I recently served as a guinea pig for a stylist who got the Defining Cream Gel into his salon. After sitting under the dryer, it gave me "ribbon curls" like they said but it was really crunchy. He put it in pretty thick just like it instructed in the picture but it was waaaaay too much. I went home, rinsed about half of it out and then mixed in my Shea Moisture Curl Enhancing Smoothie. SO much better! I really like it. I think the trick is to use more moisture than gel. He put enough in my hair to last me a week! I am curious to use the stretching cream as I am always complaining about shrinkage. I imagine if the shrinking cream doesn't have hold and has a good amount of moisture, it may work well with a little bit of the cream gel.