Adding Gel to Co-wash as suggested in CG Book

I'm certainly curious too. I wonder if it is better to add to lo poo or rinse out conditioner. I'll be guinnea pig! I haven't had much luck this winter, so who knows...maybe this'll be my HG. Definitely don't wanna use a pricey gel for sure though.

I think I will try it with a loo poo first.


Lady Caiside, Noble Lushetarian and Wavy Wayfarer of Mugglswick, in the Order of the Curly Crusaders

2b-3a Fii, porous and low elasticity

Currently using a variety of products, and looking for that magic combo

Hair bio: http://www.naturallycurly.com/curlta...5&postcount=59

I'm certainly curious too. I wonder if it is better to add to lo poo or rinse out conditioner. I'll be guinnea pig! I haven't had much luck this winter, so who knows...maybe this'll be my HG. Definitely don't wanna use a pricey gel for sure though.

I think I will try it with a loo poo first.
Originally Posted by plunkybug
it's worth a try plunky, I'm very impressed with my 2nd day hair, normally I have to heavily spritz it and add more gel but not today. Just a spritz of water was enough to revive the gel.
I think you'd get the right result from supersoaking or even just applying products to quite wet hair, it seems like the ultimate goal is very evenly distributed product.
I know what you're saying IAgirl about this but here's my thought at least for my own hair. Whenever I try to add a lot of gel in the hopes of getting more hold I end up with rubbery waves. Doing it this way I didn't end up producty or rubbery at all but I also didn't rinse it out all the way. Super Soaking didn't work for me either. I'm going to keep doing this, this will be a great way to use up some of my gels that weren't a strong enough hold for me
Discovered CG 2007

2C Fia BSL/Thick/Med-Coarse/Low(crown)-Normal Porosity Protein and Oil Sensitive

Link-Spritz & Condish Washing

I'm aCurlJunkieJunky

My hair LOVES Coconut DESPISES Soap Bars


CJRehab or H&B Fix, Deva NO POO, EO Rose & Cham POO & Condish, CJ CurlFix, CJ Pattern Pusha, CJ CIAB, SS FHG, KCCC, BRHG, AG Mousse Gel, ACV Rinses,Shikakai Conditioning Hair Rinse.
Next we'll be on to the Gel only wash.
Next we'll be on to the Gel only wash.
Originally Posted by crwritt
I'm leaving that one for you I need plenty of conditioner for my thick tresses. You're already half way there anyway after your last experiment
Discovered CG 2007

2C Fia BSL/Thick/Med-Coarse/Low(crown)-Normal Porosity Protein and Oil Sensitive

Link-Spritz & Condish Washing

I'm aCurlJunkieJunky

My hair LOVES Coconut DESPISES Soap Bars


CJRehab or H&B Fix, Deva NO POO, EO Rose & Cham POO & Condish, CJ CurlFix, CJ Pattern Pusha, CJ CIAB, SS FHG, KCCC, BRHG, AG Mousse Gel, ACV Rinses,Shikakai Conditioning Hair Rinse.
I mixed gel with my rinse out, but I got really bad tangles. I ended up adding a ton of rinse out again, just to untangle. I did have more root curl but it didn't do much for the rest. For me, the root curl is not worth the nasty way my hair felt. Clipping gives me the same results.

However, I'm not going to give up on it yet. Next, I'll try using just the gel, not mixed, after my rinse out to see how that works. Seems a bit like an extreme Super Soaker, but with gel. Will let you all know how it turns out.
Wurly 2b/2c/3a Miii - high porosity




Cuius testiculos habes, habeas cardia et cerebellum.

Sodomy non sapiens.

- Terry Pratchett
wavynwild you're cute


Well I was feeling rather confused in the shower tonight...I didn't feel like trying Gel/LI/Gel maybe in the Summer that could work but knowing my hair and it's moisture needs in Winter, I didn't want to do that yet. So what I did was after washing my scalp/crown area I added conditioner to my length let it sit for a few mins. Took about a 1/2 dollar amt of gel and squished it through then rinsed lightly while keeping it scrunched like the CG books instructs for wavies. Then I added my LI/KCCC plopped and added BRHG. This seemed to work nicely I got more clumping, definition and I don't feel producty. We'll see how DAY 2 goes.I had 3/4 of a bottle of Got2B handy which has been sitting around for months as a decoration under my sink. It's relatively inexpensive so I'd be willing to keep doing this if the results continue. I would NEVER use my precious BRHG
Originally Posted by DEL2C
Aw, thanks! Ok, I'm going around in circles here, but I am probably trying RO conditioner, gel on top, rinse a little, and style tomorrow if I don't chicken out!! Last time I'm gonna change my mind -- I promise!! I was thinking of experimenting with extra gel tomorrow anyway, so this might work out. Also wanted to check out the "double plop." Hmm, interesting...we'll see how this all goes!

I'm having a hard time wrapping my waves around the idea of mixing gel with co-wash and rinsing it out out. I guess I'm also too sensible like IAgirl But, taking into consideration that gel evaporates faster in the colder months I am willing to try Gel/LI/Gel but maybe a quick rinse in between? I don't like feeling producty and like you I've been preferring 2nd day vs 1st day this Winter.
Originally Posted by DEL2C
Yeah, I don't like wasting gel, either!! No sense in putting it in if it gets washed right down the drain. Gel/LI/gel might be an interesting idea. I always liked the idea of gel AFTER a LI because it sounds like a good way to seal in moisture.

YAY!!!! Someone else who likes 2nd day hair!!! WOO HOO! We should form a club or something. I don't see many people who like 2nd day hair. My first day hair is actually pretty horrifying at best! It never looks right! I love you right now, Del! Rock on, better-2nd-day-hair curlies!

I love your hair, Crwritt! Beautiful clumps. If that's the usual, you have some rockin' curls on a daily basis!
Originally Posted by wavynwild16
I like my second day hair enough to wear it pretty often. It never looks as good as freshly cowashed and dried, though. I want to add something to my assessment of the conditioner-gel wash. My hair feels like it has more hold. There is literally no frizz. The front of my hair looks better than usual.I think
everyone should give it a try once anyway, with some cheap gel, maybe some you bought a giant bottle of and didn't really like.
You only need a handful to the most, mix it in your hand with you co wash and see what you think. It seems silly, but it does add some nice slip and you may see a difference in your curls.
Originally Posted by crwritt
Ah, another 2nd-day-hair-lover! Welcome to the club!
Type 2c/3a with lots of hair and a super sensitive scalp! Med/slightly coarse texture, low porosity and elasticity.

Favorite...
Low poo: Organix TTM, Essential Wholesale Free & Clean
RO/LI: TN, GFTN, YTC
Stylers: EcoStylers, GF Curl Shaping Gel, Aussie Aussome Volume Mousse & Instant Freeze Gel, GFPC, LALNC, La Bella Lots of Curls, Apricot Oil, KMFUM, AO B5DG
Extras: sugar scrubs, AVG washes, pre-poos with EVCO, oiling scalp before washes, plopping, gelatin PT.
Mod-CG since 12/1/10!
I tried this tonight...I added a little condish to my ends, then mixed HEBE with my low poo and worked in well, rinsed well, and followed with my conditioner and detangled. I didn't use any styling creams or curl enhancers..just a little more condish as LI and more gel. Plopped and diffused. I have been in the habit of drying the roots by my part right side up for a few minutes before flipping upside down. I can't say so far whether this is much different than normal or not but it is still a wee bit damp so I can't SOTC yet, though I am going to bed now. Wondering if I should try to pineapple...I haven't pineappled in ages as I'm afraid it pulls out curls and waves in spots. I'll have to see how it all looks before I head to bed.


Lady Caiside, Noble Lushetarian and Wavy Wayfarer of Mugglswick, in the Order of the Curly Crusaders

2b-3a Fii, porous and low elasticity

Currently using a variety of products, and looking for that magic combo

Hair bio: http://www.naturallycurly.com/curlta...5&postcount=59

I tried mixing some EcoStyler with my JC Too Shea, applied, and then rinsed out. It was strange to apply it, but it rinsed out very well. I also think that my hair felt more full and even a little wavier.

My curls turned out pretty good. I'm going to try it again with a bit more gel next time.

Tentative success.

B]Shampoo[/B]: Jessicurl Gentle Lather Shampoo or Elucence
Rinse Out: Jessicurl Aloeba Conditioner
Leave In Conditioner: JC Aloeba or Oyin Honey Hemp and Hair Dew
Stylers: LOC Method JC Softening Hair Oil (mostly avocado) and Darcy's Curl Smoother
Technique: pinning front
2b fine (some "real curls" on rainy days, or when the stars align ), fine texture, normal to low porosity
Always trying to find ways to keep my curls!
I almost started a thread but thought we could brainstorm a bit here first. IAgirl hope you'll tune in

So this body boost conditioner contains Hydrocellulose, isn't that what we find in gels to give them hold?? I can't say I've ever noticed this before in a conditioner. Isn't this similar to adding gel to condish then? Or is this ingredient used for some other purpose??

Aqua (Water), Cetyl Alcohol, Behentrimonium Chloride, Starch Acetate, Cetyl Esters, Parfum (Fragrance), Pyrus Malus (Apple Fruit Extract), Hydroxyethylcellulose, Propylene Glycol, Niacinamide, Pyridoxine HCl, Chlorhexidine Digluconate, Benzyl Alcohol, Citric Acid, Saccharum Officinarum Extract (Sugar Cane Extract), Linalool, Butylphenyl Methylpropional, Panax Ginseng Extract (Panax Ginseng Root Extract), Citrus Medica Limonium Peel Extract (Lemon Peel Extract), Camellia Sinensis Extract (Camellia Sinensis Leaf Extract)


Garnier Fructis SILICONE FREE


ETA: Saw several "volumizing" conditioners at the drugstore and they all seem to have this ingredient hydrocellulose in common? Hmmmmmmmmmmmm IAgirl where R U?
Discovered CG 2007

2C Fia BSL/Thick/Med-Coarse/Low(crown)-Normal Porosity Protein and Oil Sensitive

Link-Spritz & Condish Washing

I'm aCurlJunkieJunky

My hair LOVES Coconut DESPISES Soap Bars


CJRehab or H&B Fix, Deva NO POO, EO Rose & Cham POO & Condish, CJ CurlFix, CJ Pattern Pusha, CJ CIAB, SS FHG, KCCC, BRHG, AG Mousse Gel, ACV Rinses,Shikakai Conditioning Hair Rinse.

Last edited by DEL2C; 01-30-2011 at 08:24 AM.
Itchy IAGirl has been avoiding this thread because she felt guilty for not doing more experiments -- but afraid of gel near scalp adding itch.
Hydroxyethylcellulose is a thickener, but it also is a polymer and most things added to products to give hold are polymers. I just made a batch of conditioner and added some because it was runny and this thickens and helps it spread around without weighing my hair down. It's definitely a good product in a hair gel for adding hold. I put some in my FSG. It rinses off well.
The condish I make has both guar and hydroxyethylcellulose, but not too much of the Behentrimonium-type emulisifiers/film formers/detenglers because they weigh my hair down. If I don't rinse this out for too long, it does act a bit like a curl cream. So it's a little like having "gel" in your conditioner, depending on how much is there. Maybe more like a curl cream because of all the emollients/emulsifiers.

I think our skin and water supplies are better off having products thickened with guar and hydroxyethylcellulose than with things like PEG because the latter can be irritating to the skin and kind of nasty, otherwise.
Del says "Took about a 1/2 dollar amt of gel and squished it through then rinsed lightly while keeping it scrunched like the CG books instructs for wavies. Then I added my LI/KCCC plopped and added BRHG. This seemed to work nicely I got more clumping, definition and I don't feel producty."
I'm going to give this a try because I HATE rubbery clumps. But I don't like a ton of hold, either so I'm pretty easy to please.


I almost started a thread but thought we could brainstorm a bit here first. IAgirl hope you'll tune in

So this body boost conditioner contains Hydrocellulose, isn't that what we find in gels to give them hold?? I can't say I've ever noticed this before in a conditioner. Isn't this similar to adding gel to condish then? Or is this ingredient used for some other purpose??

Aqua (Water), Cetyl Alcohol, Behentrimonium Chloride, Starch Acetate, Cetyl Esters, Parfum (Fragrance), Pyrus Malus (Apple Fruit Extract), Hydroxyethylcellulose, Propylene Glycol, Niacinamide, Pyridoxine HCl, Chlorhexidine Digluconate, Benzyl Alcohol, Citric Acid, Saccharum Officinarum Extract (Sugar Cane Extract), Linalool, Butylphenyl Methylpropional, Panax Ginseng Extract (Panax Ginseng Root Extract), Citrus Medica Limonium Peel Extract (Lemon Peel Extract), Camellia Sinensis Extract (Camellia Sinensis Leaf Extract)


Garnier Fructis SILICONE FREE


ETA: Saw several "volumizing" conditioners at the drugstore and they all seem to have this ingredient hydrocellulose in common? Hmmmmmmmmmmmm IAgirl where R U?
Originally Posted by DEL2C
http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.com/

Last edited by IAgirl; 01-30-2011 at 09:58 AM.


Yay she made it! Thanks for your input lady, I picked up this conditioner and plan to try it today. Normally whenever I see anything that is volumizing I RUN the other way but I'm intrigued by the possibility of a little extra hold and definition. KCCC seems to cut down my volume so I can play around without risking getting too BIG. In the Summer it's a diff story though, KCC makes my hair swell up HUGE.

BTW: I still haven't had a need for protein BTW so haven't made up your PT but will update that too.

So I'll let you all know if I notice anything different using this condish
Discovered CG 2007

2C Fia BSL/Thick/Med-Coarse/Low(crown)-Normal Porosity Protein and Oil Sensitive

Link-Spritz & Condish Washing

I'm aCurlJunkieJunky

My hair LOVES Coconut DESPISES Soap Bars


CJRehab or H&B Fix, Deva NO POO, EO Rose & Cham POO & Condish, CJ CurlFix, CJ Pattern Pusha, CJ CIAB, SS FHG, KCCC, BRHG, AG Mousse Gel, ACV Rinses,Shikakai Conditioning Hair Rinse.
I used to use the Garnier Triple Nutrition and it made my hair feel more tangly. But this new one shouldn't be like that, looking at the ingredients. I think the "volumizing" claim comes from the inclusion of the modified starch (ingredient #4). HE-cellulose isn't what I'd call "volumizing." Isn't starch one of the "active" ingredients in AG Re-coil?

Will be interested to hear people's reviews of this new conditioner!
http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.com/
I used to use the Garnier Triple Nutrition and it made my hair feel more tangly. But this new one shouldn't be like that, looking at the ingredients. I think the "volumizing" claim comes from the inclusion of the modified starch (ingredient #4). HE-cellulose isn't what I'd call "volumizing." Isn't starch one of the "active" ingredients in AG Re-coil?

Will be interested to hear people's reviews of this new conditioner!
Originally Posted by IAgirl
Now I can't remember what the difference was between the volumizing one and the fortifying conditioner? I remember looking at them and noticing very similar ingredients.
http://www.garnierusa.com/_en/_us/ou...prdcode=P41020

I can't find the ingredients on-line but I could've sworn it didn't have any cones.

So the Peg starch is the volumizing ingredient hmm. You're right AG Recoil does have something similar which is why I like it with KCCC, they seem to off-set each other. I think this volumizing version would make a nice LI if it doesn't flake. I honestly can't say whether my hair looks/feels any different while wet. I think it's a nice protein free conditioner for a drug store brand though It's nothing like the Triple Nutrition that was a little heavy for me, this one is not heavy but still had nice slip and plenty of conditioning. I used it as a co-wash/LI one step from the ears down after scalp cleansing and rinsing the low poo through.


ETA: I had tried the Wonder Waves conditioner ONCE and really disliked it so using this one once and liking it seems promising.
Discovered CG 2007

2C Fia BSL/Thick/Med-Coarse/Low(crown)-Normal Porosity Protein and Oil Sensitive

Link-Spritz & Condish Washing

I'm aCurlJunkieJunky

My hair LOVES Coconut DESPISES Soap Bars


CJRehab or H&B Fix, Deva NO POO, EO Rose & Cham POO & Condish, CJ CurlFix, CJ Pattern Pusha, CJ CIAB, SS FHG, KCCC, BRHG, AG Mousse Gel, ACV Rinses,Shikakai Conditioning Hair Rinse.

Last edited by DEL2C; 01-30-2011 at 12:35 PM.
The "Garnier Daily Care Fortifying" you linked to has cones. Ingredients:Aqua (Water), Cetearyl Alcohol, PEG 180, Behentrimonium Chloride, Amodimethicone, Pyrus Malus (Apple) Fruit Extract, Parfum/Fragrance, Cetyl Esters, Lauryl PEG/PPG 18/18 Methicone, Methylparaben, Hydroxyethylcellulose, Lanolin, Niacinamide, Pyridoxine HCI, Trideceth 12, Citric Acid, Saccharum Officinarum (Sugar Cane) Extract, Chlorhexidine Dihydrochloride, Cetrimonium Chloride, Linalool, Citrus Limonium (Lemon) Fruit Extract, Camellia Sinensis Leaf Extract So it must have been the other one.
I suppose "starch acetate" might add volume. I've never used anything with starch, I don't think.
Hope the new Garnier-whichever-one-it-is, is a winner.
http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.com/
The "Garnier Daily Care Fortifying" you linked to has cones. Ingredients:Aqua (Water), Cetearyl Alcohol, PEG 180, Behentrimonium Chloride, Amodimethicone, Pyrus Malus (Apple) Fruit Extract, Parfum/Fragrance, Cetyl Esters, Lauryl PEG/PPG 18/18 Methicone, Methylparaben, Hydroxyethylcellulose, Lanolin, Niacinamide, Pyridoxine HCI, Trideceth 12, Citric Acid, Saccharum Officinarum (Sugar Cane) Extract, Chlorhexidine Dihydrochloride, Cetrimonium Chloride, Linalool, Citrus Limonium (Lemon) Fruit Extract, Camellia Sinensis Leaf Extract So it must have been the other one.
I suppose "starch acetate" might add volume. I've never used anything with starch, I don't think.
Hope the new Garnier-whichever-one-it-is, is a winner.
Originally Posted by IAgirl
Ewwwwwww and it has Lanolin too? Funny I don't recall seeing that at the store when I looked at it. I definitely will check again though, maybe they've made some changes to the formula. The A-cone would be nice for me in the Summer, love it then but not now in the colder weather. I completely air dried tonight and normally when I do that my hair is a little flat. I didn't get that this time using this conditioner so maybe it does have some body boosting power, another reason for me to avoid it in Summer IA girl you make your own concoctions so you probably don't have a need for a drug store condish.
Wavies, try it you may like it!
Discovered CG 2007

2C Fia BSL/Thick/Med-Coarse/Low(crown)-Normal Porosity Protein and Oil Sensitive

Link-Spritz & Condish Washing

I'm aCurlJunkieJunky

My hair LOVES Coconut DESPISES Soap Bars


CJRehab or H&B Fix, Deva NO POO, EO Rose & Cham POO & Condish, CJ CurlFix, CJ Pattern Pusha, CJ CIAB, SS FHG, KCCC, BRHG, AG Mousse Gel, ACV Rinses,Shikakai Conditioning Hair Rinse.
Del, I tried your "applying gel after conditioner" method, and I'm not sure how I like it. It definitely didn't make my hair producty or rubbery, which was nice, but I'm not sure if I like it or dislike it. I'm not sure if I'd try it again, because it didn't do anything different that putting all my gel in after the shower wouldn't do, besides the less-producty feel of my hair. I dunno, maybe I did something wrong or rinsed it out too much.
Type 2c/3a with lots of hair and a super sensitive scalp! Med/slightly coarse texture, low porosity and elasticity.

Favorite...
Low poo: Organix TTM, Essential Wholesale Free & Clean
RO/LI: TN, GFTN, YTC
Stylers: EcoStylers, GF Curl Shaping Gel, Aussie Aussome Volume Mousse & Instant Freeze Gel, GFPC, LALNC, La Bella Lots of Curls, Apricot Oil, KMFUM, AO B5DG
Extras: sugar scrubs, AVG washes, pre-poos with EVCO, oiling scalp before washes, plopping, gelatin PT.
Mod-CG since 12/1/10!
Hey, Del, I might actually be able to use that Garnier! Usually stuff like that weighs my hair down but my big problem it itchy ingredients or to much scent. Garnier stuff usually has that sort of "green apple" thing going.
I will be looking for it at the store...
http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.com/
Okay, so I know this thread is pretty old, but I have one question: Do you scrub your scalp with the gel/conditioner mix?
Well that was a disaster! I tried it out this morning. I used Tresemme Naturals conditioner and some Boots Purple cheapy gel. I loosely mixed them together then slopped it on for a CO wash. The two mixed together and turned into a cottage cheese like mush that took ages to rinse out. I styled exactly the same way I did yesterday and ended up with stringy, no clump hair. Yesterdays hair was awesome in comparison. Huge fail, Ms. Massey.


Sent from my iPhone using CurlTalk
Though I don't have the revised CG book, I think in the original General Discussions post Morgan said that Lorraine Massey says to mix it with a sulfate-free cleanser. I interpret that to mean a low-poo rather than a co-wash, and I'd think the gel would mix better with that than with some conditioners - I'd expect "cottage cheese" in some of those type mixtures . . . .

All this said, I still haven't thought to try this - I'd forgotten about it until it reappeared in New Posts today.
2C/3A/3B - modified CG - med./fine, normal/low porosity/normal elasticity

Current Main Rotation: MG217 medicated or Aim2Health 'poos for scalp, YTCarrots or Elucence cond., Spiral Solutions Protein & Deeply Decadent Cond., CJCCCC reg or lite, KCCC, Giovanni LA Hold Hair Spritz + lots more, sporadically

HG Method: Super Soaker + Smasters-ing, brief upside down diffusing w/360o diffuser then clips/clamps & air dry. Newly gray - stopped my henna glosses!

www.fotki.com/auntnett

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