Is there a way to do CG with some non CG products?

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  • 1 Post By Firefox7275

I'm brand new to the idea of no-poo. I'm also new to this site. And to make it even tougher, I'm new to having wavy hair. When I was a kid, my hair was stick straight. Now it's flat-ish on top but has a serious wave "problem" at the bottom. I figured other things change as we age, maybe hair could too.

Last night I tried the Deva 3 step with non DevaCurl products (as I don't own any). The results were crazy! After conditioning my hair the way the video showed, there were serious waves starting to show. After scrunching, there were more.

I was wondering, since my hair gets oily so fast (partly due to where I work), can a similar routine to the Curly Girl routine be done with some not CG safe products? Or is there a conditioner that's safe to use on highly oily hair without shampooing? Like washing with that, and it actually works to get out all the greasy-ness?

Currently I use Evercreme/curl shampoo and conditioner, and I used a curl lock cream from Cost cutters (I could probably do better here..). I use a microfiber towel too.

If it helps, I'm definitely a 2a, but with product and scrunching I can see 2b waves. Fine hair, but a lot of it.
I hear that when u first try nopoo, it may take time your to adjust to the new routine so initially you may be tempted to give up. You probably need a good month or so of doing nopoo. So I would say to hang in there. You can also choose to continue with the nopoo but once a month clarify your hair with a sulfate shampoo or low sulfate shampoo. This way you may get the best of both worlds. Google "nopoo and hair adjustment" for more info.
Correction. It may take time for your hair to adjust ...
Welcome! Done properly conditioner only washing is as effective as shampooing for getting excess oil out, I can shift several tablespoons of coconut oil. The wrong cleansing products can irritate the scalp causing increased sebum production, this can take days or weeks to settle down so don't assume you have 'naturally' greasy hair.

Lightweight co-wash conditioners include Inecto, Suave Naturals or VO5, look for something with a cationic surfactant high up the list. However technique is everything, use plenty of product, massage gently but thoroughly, add a little extra water if needed to get a light 'lather', massage again as you are rinsing. Also do a freezing cold rinse before you wash, that helps empty the sebaceous glands so you can wash away the sebum.

Do you work in a kitchen? If you can cover your hair at work go ahead. I would avoid all silicones, even the water soluble ones as these can make your hair seem oilier faster. You might also limit the more powerful humectants like glycerin if the work environment is steamy, that will encourage frizz and possibly attract residues to your hair.

With fine hair you may benefit from plenty of hydrolysed protein, perhaps in a daily conditioner, that might also give your hair more body and counteract any greasiness; proteins can also help boost waves. I am liking Schwarzkopf Gliss (Kur) Ultimate Volume conditioner if it's available where you are, Mill Creek biotin conditioner has good ingredients, or Komaza Care Matani repair treatment spray could be used under another basic conditioner.

Also review your diet and lifestyle, an anti inflammatory nutrient dense wholefood diet and anti stress lifestyle can alter the amount and composition of your sebum.
Neleke likes this.
2a-2c, medium texture, porous/ colour treated. Three years CG. Past bra strap length heading for waist.

CO-wash: Inecto coconut/ Elvive Volume Collagen
Treatments: Komaza Care Matani, coconut/ sweet almond/ fractionated coconut oils, Hairveda Sitrinillah
Leave in: Fructis Sleek & Shine (old), Gliss Ultimate Volume, various Elvive
Styler: Umberto Giannini jelly, Au Naturale styling gelee
Flour sack towel, pixie diffuse or air dry.
Experimenting with: benign neglect
I may have understood this wrong but, as I understand it you would want to become CG, right? and you would like to continue using something cleansing such as shampoo and are worried that they are nonCG products and so on?

As I understand it (other curlies, correct me if I am wrong) you can still use a sulphate- and siliconefree shampoo and still be CG, so maybe you could try that?
2c: fine texture, normal porosity, normal elasticity, normal-high density
CG since March 8th 2013
Low Poo: Rainforest Radiance shampoo
Conditioner: Yes to Cucumbers
Styler: BRHG, Garnier Fructis Gel
PT: Gliss Kur Repair & Volume


iherb.com: get a 5$ discount on orders under 40$ or a 10$ discount on orders over 40$ when you order for your first order by using the following discount code: CFH441
Hello and welcome!

This is going to be a lot of semantics. Technically, you can't be CG and use non-CG-friendly products.

A lot of wavies can't use the no poo or cowash only method. Many use low poos (non-sulfate shampoos). Some consider this CG and others call it mod-CG (modified). Again, semantics.

I guess the question here is what non-CG products do you not want to part with and why? Sulfates? Silicones?
Wave Pattern: 2A
Hair Properties: Normal/Low Porosity, Medium Density, Medium Texture w/Fine Straight Underlayer
Co-wash: Suave Naturals, Cure Care
Low-poo: Renpure Brazilian Keratin
Rinse Out & Leave In: Tresemme Naturals
Gel: LA Looks Mega Mega Hold Gel, Garnier Fructis Spray Gel
Thanks for all the advice.

Yeah, I've heard that too. I've taken baby steps, like washing my hair every other day, or not washing my hair for at most 2 1/2 days, to try and get it used to not being shampooed. Because my shampoo/conditioner aren't truly sulfate/silicone/whatever free (even though the bottles say they are..) I don't know how much good it's actually doing me.

I'll have to pick up something tomorrow to try for conditioner washing. I'm a little nervous though, cause the conditioner I own now gives my hair an almost greasy feeling when I use it.

Yes, I work in a kitchen. We have hats, but the kitchen is so hot that just makes it sweaty-dirty, as opposed to kitchen-dirty. I think the fact I shove it in a pony tail almost daily is partly to blame for how my hair looks down too. One problem at a time though.

Ah, diet is a problem, I'm sure. I don't get the proper nutrients needed for a healthy diet, as I tend to only eat one or two small meals a day. And I've heard not drinking enough water causes problems too. I don't really drink water at all, so I can start with that and see if that helps anything.

Yes, Neleke, I'd love to be able to fully follow the CG routine. For now, while I can't really take time to wait out the transition period, I'd want a modified routine. When I first heard about CG, I bought sulfate free marked shampoo/conditioner. I later learned there actually were sulfates and silicones in them. :/ I'm hoping to find a completely CG safe conditioner, and a truly sulfate free shampoo.

HairObsessed- I don't really know what exactly it is I don't want to part with. So far this has all been a big experiment. Ideally, I'd like a shampoo to use, if conditioner only washing doesn't do the trick. I'm more wavy than curly unless I add gel or scrunch like crazy, so if there's a good wavy hair product that anyone swears by, I'd love to know of it. I know that when I switched from my old shampoo to L'Oreal Evercreme, there was a big difference, so even though it does have sulfates (I was told..) perhaps there's less, and that just worked with my hair.

Hopefully this makes sense. Like I said, it's been a big experiment, in a sense, as I have no knowledge of the products and how they work or the ingredients and what they do.
You don't want to give up sulfates and keep putting silicones on your hair - you'll get build up. But using sulfates will strip away natural oils and make your scalp overproduce oils.. Removing you need to remove sulfates and silicones should give you hair that is less dry and will result in more curl/wave and scalp that is less oily.

What are the exact products you are using? We can help you look at ingredients.
3A/2C fine, normal porosity & elasticity, medium high density

Current products:
YTCucs Color Protection Low poo
GVP Conditioning Balm
Random gels - not sure which ones I like, if any at this point!


HG Summer Routine:
poo - TMW Hydrate
RO & LI - Darcy's Pumpkin Seed
Leave in Products: CHSCK & LALMG
PT - CJ RM
DT - EVCO

Currently trying to figure out a winter routine and transition to a less harsh "poo" for summer.
Thanks for all the advice.

Yeah, I've heard that too. I've taken baby steps, like washing my hair every other day, or not washing my hair for at most 2 1/2 days, to try and get it used to not being shampooed. Because my shampoo/conditioner aren't truly sulfate/silicone/whatever free (even though the bottles say they are..) I don't know how much good it's actually doing me.

I'll have to pick up something tomorrow to try for conditioner washing. I'm a little nervous though, cause the conditioner I own now gives my hair an almost greasy feeling when I use it.

Yes, I work in a kitchen. We have hats, but the kitchen is so hot that just makes it sweaty-dirty, as opposed to kitchen-dirty. I think the fact I shove it in a pony tail almost daily is partly to blame for how my hair looks down too. One problem at a time though.

Ah, diet is a problem, I'm sure. I don't get the proper nutrients needed for a healthy diet, as I tend to only eat one or two small meals a day. And I've heard not drinking enough water causes problems too. I don't really drink water at all, so I can start with that and see if that helps anything.

Yes, Neleke, I'd love to be able to fully follow the CG routine. For now, while I can't really take time to wait out the transition period, I'd want a modified routine. When I first heard about CG, I bought sulfate free marked shampoo/conditioner. I later learned there actually were sulfates and silicones in them. :/ I'm hoping to find a completely CG safe conditioner, and a truly sulfate free shampoo.

HairObsessed- I don't really know what exactly it is I don't want to part with. So far this has all been a big experiment. Ideally, I'd like a shampoo to use, if conditioner only washing doesn't do the trick. I'm more wavy than curly unless I add gel or scrunch like crazy, so if there's a good wavy hair product that anyone swears by, I'd love to know of it. I know that when I switched from my old shampoo to L'Oreal Evercreme, there was a big difference, so even though it does have sulfates (I was told..) perhaps there's less, and that just worked with my hair.

Hopefully this makes sense. Like I said, it's been a big experiment, in a sense, as I have no knowledge of the products and how they work or the ingredients and what they do.
Originally Posted by Celly
Hi

Like other people have said, there's an adjustment period for hair once you leave shampoo behind. If you think that it's where you work which is causing the problem, you can find a list of gentle alternatives to SLS as well as tips on reading product labels here: How to Determine if a Hair Product is Curly Girl Approved
I'm using L'oreal Evercreme shampoo, and their evercurl conditioner. Both say sulfate free.
The leave in conditioners are also from the Evercreme line of products, also says sulfate free.


Thanks for the link 3Rotini. I'll check that out.
L`Oreal Paris EverCreme Sulfate-Free Moisture System Intense Nourishing ShampooAqua/Water/Eau, Sodium Cocoyl Isethionate, Sodium Lauryl Sulfoacetate, Disodium Laureth Sulfosuccinate, Sodium Lauroyl Sarcosinate, Cocamidopropyl Betaine, Glycol Distearate, Glycereth-26, Decyl Glucoside, Amodimethicone, Parfum/Fragrance, Hydrogenated Coconut Acid, PPG-55 Ceteth 20, Glycerin, Polyquaternium-7, PEG-55 Propylene Glycol Oleate, Propylene Glycol, Polyquaternium-10, Sodium Isethionate, Carbomer, Benzoic Acid, Trideceth-6, Tocopherol, Hexyl Cinnamal, Linalool, Cetrimonium Chloride, Camelina Sativa Oil/Camelina Sativa Seed Oil, Prunus Armeniaca Kernel Oil/Apricot Kernel Oil, Vitis Vinifera Seed Oil/Grape Seed Oil, Coumarin, Methylchloroisothiazolinone, Methylisothiazolinone, Sodium Hydroxide, Citric Acid.

L`Oreal Paris EverCreme Sulfate-Free Moisture System Intense Nourishing ShampooAqua/Water/Eau, Cocamidopropyl Betaine, Sodium Lauryl Sulfoacetate, Disodium Laureth Sulfosuccinate, Sodium Lauryl Sarcosinate, Glycol Distearate, Decyl Glucoside, Parfum/Fragrance, Polyquaternium-10, PPG-5-Ceteth-20, Glycerin, Sodium Benzoate, Coco-Betaine, PEG-55 Propylene Glycol Oleate, Propylene Glycol, Salicylic Acid, Carbomer, Benzoic Acid, Hexyl Cinnamal, Linalool, Camelina Sativa Oil/Camelina Sativa Seed Oil, Prunus Armeniaca Kernel Oil/Apricot Kernel Oil, Vitis Vinifera Seed Oil/Grape Seed Oil, Sodium Hydroxide, Citric Acid.

L`Oreal Paris EverCurl Hydracharge Conditioner Water, Cetearyl Alcohol, Glycerin, Behentrimonium Chloride, Cetyl Esters, Isopropyl Myristate, Quaternium 80, Polysorbate 20, Fragrance, Phenoxyethanol, Isopropyl Alcohol, Benzyl Benzoate, Benzyl Alcohol, Polyquaternium 37, Paraffinum Liquidum (Mineral Oil), Cocos Nucifera (Coconut) Oil, Vitis Vinifera (Grape) Seed Oil, Chlorhexidine Dihydrochloride, Linalool, Hexyl Cinnamal, Butylphenyl Methylpropional, PPG 1 Trideceth 6, Coumarin, Aminomethylpropanol, Hibiscus Esculentus Seed Extract, Citrus Aurantium Dulcis (Orange) Peel Oil

L`Oreal Paris EverCreme Sulfate-Free Moisture System Nourishing Leave-In SprayAqua/Water/Eau, Cetearyl Alcohol, Sodium PCA, Phenoxyethanol, Arginine, Behentrimonium Chloride, Trideceth-6, Chlorhexidine Dihydrochloride, Camelina Sativa Oil/Camelina Sativa Seed Oil, Linalool, Amodimethicone, Isopropyl Alcohol, Parfum/Fragrance, Cetyl Alcohol, Citric Acid, Vitis Vinifera Seed Oil/Grape Seed Oil, Cetrimonium Chloride, Prunus Armeniaca Kernel Oil/Apricot Kernel Oil, Coumarin, Hexyl Cinnamal, Glycerin.
3A/2C fine, normal porosity & elasticity, medium high density

Current products:
YTCucs Color Protection Low poo
GVP Conditioning Balm
Random gels - not sure which ones I like, if any at this point!


HG Summer Routine:
poo - TMW Hydrate
RO & LI - Darcy's Pumpkin Seed
Leave in Products: CHSCK & LALMG
PT - CJ RM
DT - EVCO

Currently trying to figure out a winter routine and transition to a less harsh "poo" for summer.
The most important thing IMO (others may disagree) is to cut sulfates, which dry out hair like crazy (and drying alcohols).

If you want to cut sulfates but still use silicones you can, you just need a sulfate-free low-poo that has coco-betaine or cocamidopropyl betaine in the ingredients list. This won't be CG, maybe mod-CG depending on who you ask.

What's the Scoop on Silicones?

However, you may find coco or coca. betaine still too harsh. For instance, I can use shampoos that have c. betaine in them, but not as the second ingredient. They have to be more in the middle of the ingredients list; if they are in higher concentration I find them too harsh. Refer to the link below on surfactants. You can print it and take it shopping with you.

What Makes a Cleansing Ingredient More Harsh or More Gentle?

To get the full benefits of CG I would recommend going for poos with very mild surfactants... the ones that can't break down silicones. So yes you'll have to give up silicones too.

Remember that being CG isn't only about cutting silicones and sulfates, it's also about taking better care of your hair, and that includes deep (condition and/or protein) treatments, handling your hair gently, not brushing while dry, no ironing, no high heat, and no re-texturizing.
2BC/f/II. fine - low/normal porosity - medium density - normal elasticity.

Currently using:
Cowash: Cure Care diluted with water 1:1
RO: Cure Care, V05 Kiwi Lime
Styler: UFD CM (old formula), FSG + CNPF
PT: IAgirl's gelatine

Experimenting with: CeraVe Foaming as low-poo, gelatin gel

light moisture, hydrolized protein, jelly stylers
guar hydroxypropyltrimonium chloride, sulfates
Neutral on cones.

iherb discount code: CFN646
Thanks for all the advice.

Yeah, I've heard that too. I've taken baby steps, like washing my hair every other day, or not washing my hair for at most 2 1/2 days, to try and get it used to not being shampooed. Because my shampoo/conditioner aren't truly sulfate/silicone/whatever free (even though the bottles say they are..) I don't know how much good it's actually doing me.

I'll have to pick up something tomorrow to try for conditioner washing. I'm a little nervous though, cause the conditioner I own now gives my hair an almost greasy feeling when I use it.

Yes, I work in a kitchen. We have hats, but the kitchen is so hot that just makes it sweaty-dirty, as opposed to kitchen-dirty. I think the fact I shove it in a pony tail almost daily is partly to blame for how my hair looks down too. One problem at a time though.

Ah, diet is a problem, I'm sure. I don't get the proper nutrients needed for a healthy diet, as I tend to only eat one or two small meals a day. And I've heard not drinking enough water causes problems too. I don't really drink water at all, so I can start with that and see if that helps anything.

Yes, Neleke, I'd love to be able to fully follow the CG routine. For now, while I can't really take time to wait out the transition period, I'd want a modified routine. When I first heard about CG, I bought sulfate free marked shampoo/conditioner. I later learned there actually were sulfates and silicones in them. :/ I'm hoping to find a completely CG safe conditioner, and a truly sulfate free shampoo.

HairObsessed- I don't really know what exactly it is I don't want to part with. So far this has all been a big experiment. Ideally, I'd like a shampoo to use, if conditioner only washing doesn't do the trick. I'm more wavy than curly unless I add gel or scrunch like crazy, so if there's a good wavy hair product that anyone swears by, I'd love to know of it. I know that when I switched from my old shampoo to L'Oreal Evercreme, there was a big difference, so even though it does have sulfates (I was told..) perhaps there's less, and that just worked with my hair.

Hopefully this makes sense. Like I said, it's been a big experiment, in a sense, as I have no knowledge of the products and how they work or the ingredients and what they do.
Originally Posted by Celly
Conditioner only washing will clean sweaty dirty just fine, sweat is water based anyway. What do you mean by waiting period? You mean for your scalp to adjust or your hair to adjust? I produced less sebum from day one of quitting sulphates, others don't get that for weeks but are not actually producing more sebum than before. Oftentimes when people report oilier hair they are using a conditioner that is more moisturising than cleansing, not enough product or poor technique. There are 'how to' videos on YouTube.

The most effective CO-wash conditioners are generally rubbish at actually conditioning, they are rich in cationic surfactants and possibly fatty alcohols both of which are emulsifiers so cleansing. And they are low in oils, butters, no silicones so nothing that can leave hair feeling greasy. In use Inecto and can work up a light 'lather' and loads of it because I like 'squeaky' clean hair, lightly massage whilst rinsing to get any residues off.

I have heard Suave Naturals and V05 are both effective, but don't feel it's 'all or nothing'. Some people do co-wash some days and use a sulphate free shampoo other days.

By all means increase your water intake but be aware your body cannot hold onto that water without the right nutrients - proteins, essential fatty acids, carbohydrates, certain minerals. Healthy eating doesn't have to be time consuming - canned oily fish, canned beans and lentils, canned tomatoes, frozen veggies or fruit are all healthy and need little to no preparation.
2a-2c, medium texture, porous/ colour treated. Three years CG. Past bra strap length heading for waist.

CO-wash: Inecto coconut/ Elvive Volume Collagen
Treatments: Komaza Care Matani, coconut/ sweet almond/ fractionated coconut oils, Hairveda Sitrinillah
Leave in: Fructis Sleek & Shine (old), Gliss Ultimate Volume, various Elvive
Styler: Umberto Giannini jelly, Au Naturale styling gelee
Flour sack towel, pixie diffuse or air dry.
Experimenting with: benign neglect
L`Oreal Paris EverCreme Sulfate-Free Moisture System Intense Nourishing ShampooAqua/Water/Eau, Sodium Cocoyl Isethionate, Sodium Lauryl Sulfoacetate, Disodium Laureth Sulfosuccinate, Sodium Lauroyl Sarcosinate, Cocamidopropyl Betaine, Glycol Distearate, Glycereth-26, Decyl Glucoside, Amodimethicone, Parfum/Fragrance, Hydrogenated Coconut Acid, PPG-55 Ceteth 20, Glycerin, Polyquaternium-7, PEG-55 Propylene Glycol Oleate, Propylene Glycol, Polyquaternium-10, Sodium Isethionate, Carbomer, Benzoic Acid, Trideceth-6, Tocopherol, Hexyl Cinnamal, Linalool, Cetrimonium Chloride, Camelina Sativa Oil/Camelina Sativa Seed Oil, Prunus Armeniaca Kernel Oil/Apricot Kernel Oil, Vitis Vinifera Seed Oil/Grape Seed Oil, Coumarin, Methylchloroisothiazolinone, Methylisothiazolinone, Sodium Hydroxide, Citric Acid.

L`Oreal Paris EverCreme Sulfate-Free Moisture System Intense Nourishing ShampooAqua/Water/Eau, Cocamidopropyl Betaine, Sodium Lauryl Sulfoacetate, Disodium Laureth Sulfosuccinate, Sodium Lauryl Sarcosinate, Glycol Distearate, Decyl Glucoside, Parfum/Fragrance, Polyquaternium-10, PPG-5-Ceteth-20, Glycerin, Sodium Benzoate, Coco-Betaine, PEG-55 Propylene Glycol Oleate, Propylene Glycol, Salicylic Acid, Carbomer, Benzoic Acid, Hexyl Cinnamal, Linalool, Camelina Sativa Oil/Camelina Sativa Seed Oil, Prunus Armeniaca Kernel Oil/Apricot Kernel Oil, Vitis Vinifera Seed Oil/Grape Seed Oil, Sodium Hydroxide, Citric Acid.

L`Oreal Paris EverCurl Hydracharge Conditioner Water, Cetearyl Alcohol, Glycerin, Behentrimonium Chloride, Cetyl Esters, Isopropyl Myristate, Quaternium 80, Polysorbate 20, Fragrance, Phenoxyethanol, Isopropyl Alcohol, Benzyl Benzoate, Benzyl Alcohol, Polyquaternium 37, Paraffinum Liquidum (Mineral Oil), Cocos Nucifera (Coconut) Oil, Vitis Vinifera (Grape) Seed Oil, Chlorhexidine Dihydrochloride, Linalool, Hexyl Cinnamal, Butylphenyl Methylpropional, PPG 1 Trideceth 6, Coumarin, Aminomethylpropanol, Hibiscus Esculentus Seed Extract, Citrus Aurantium Dulcis (Orange) Peel Oil

L`Oreal Paris EverCreme Sulfate-Free Moisture System Nourishing Leave-In SprayAqua/Water/Eau, Cetearyl Alcohol, Sodium PCA, Phenoxyethanol, Arginine, Behentrimonium Chloride, Trideceth-6, Chlorhexidine Dihydrochloride, Camelina Sativa Oil/Camelina Sativa Seed Oil, Linalool, Amodimethicone, Isopropyl Alcohol, Parfum/Fragrance, Cetyl Alcohol, Citric Acid, Vitis Vinifera Seed Oil/Grape Seed Oil, Cetrimonium Chloride, Prunus Armeniaca Kernel Oil/Apricot Kernel Oil, Coumarin, Hexyl Cinnamal, Glycerin.
Originally Posted by wheretostart
No sulphate surfactants there, other than the mineral oil they are all usable under CG. Ingredients that might cause issues with greasiness in red. Glycerin is a humectant so can be a problem in certain dew points, I suspect also for sweatier heads or steamy kitchens. Sodium PCA is also a humectant.

The leave in spray is a waste of money IMO, there is nothing 'nourishing' in that. If you want a leave in spray with useful ingredients check out Komaza Care Matani repair treatment - ceramides, hydrolysed protein, panthenol. Komaza Care also do sulphate free Moja shampoo which is pH 4.5 so gentle on scalp and hair.
Products - Komaza Care
Products - Komaza Care
2a-2c, medium texture, porous/ colour treated. Three years CG. Past bra strap length heading for waist.

CO-wash: Inecto coconut/ Elvive Volume Collagen
Treatments: Komaza Care Matani, coconut/ sweet almond/ fractionated coconut oils, Hairveda Sitrinillah
Leave in: Fructis Sleek & Shine (old), Gliss Ultimate Volume, various Elvive
Styler: Umberto Giannini jelly, Au Naturale styling gelee
Flour sack towel, pixie diffuse or air dry.
Experimenting with: benign neglect
Thank you very much everyone, for all the information. I'm hoping to try out a new washing/styling routine the next time I have a few days off from work, and hopefully with what you've all shared here, I can find products that work for me.
I love Jessicurl Gentle Lather Shampoo. Probably use it every second or third day. Cowashing alone doesn't cut it for a lot of wavies. Even Massey addresses this in her book now.
You can see my wavy tutorials here: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...ZNxhBHSXAW40OQ and my wavy blog is The Wavy Nation http://wavynation.wordpress.com

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