About Ready to Give Up?

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  • 2 Post By dinoRAWRSyou

So, I've been at this whole CG thing for almost five months now and I'm just still no sure if I should even bother... perhaps some of you could help me out.

I believe at this point I'm mod-CG due to using a low-poo but I'm not quite sure. Here's the breakdown of my hair and what's going on with it:

Low-poo with SheaM C&S approx. 3x weekly, RO is Salon Care Honey/Almond (sometimes supplemented with NPF from Sally's) or SN Coconut. DT is GVPCB, 1x weekly at most, PT is IAGirl's gelatin treatment, 1x weekly at most. Current stylers are KCCC and Garnier Fructis Pure Clean Gel. I normally smooth them over my hair while it's soaking wet, scrunch them in, and plop for at least 30min, and sometimes overnight... I've tried varying amounts of product and either end up with basically no hold or crispy, flat, unclumpy ramen-noodle curls. I do not currently use a LI as I don't want to weigh down my hair.

My hair is constantly frizzy, whether dry or wet. I thought it may have been polyquat/silicone buildup, so I cleansed with a sulfate shampoo (YTCarrots) and there was no appreciable difference. If I cowash or use a heavier conditioner, my hair gets dull and my waves fall flat and are still very frizzy. If I introduce more protein (e.g., NPF mixed into my RO), my hair gets shinier and my waves *seem* better, but there is still a ton of frizz.

My hair is 2A/2B with a mostly straight underlayer, fine, low porosity, high density, and very high elasticity, and my hair is past bra-strap-length. My wave pattern is very weak and basically no matter what I do my waves will fall flat by the end of the day... even plopping overnight and diffusing yields wimpy, frizzy waves that fall out very easily. The issue is my hair doesn't always act like it wants to be straight, because the shorter pieces give me these awkward wavy flyaways that refuse to be tamed. And, I can't just brush it out to being straight because basically the second I touch it it just puffs up and murders whatever wave I managed to get in there. I've had 1 good hair day in maybe the past 3 months.

Is my protein/moisture balance off? Am I applying my products incorrectly? Do I need different products? Or at this point am I just forcing a wave that's not there? Should I just give up and go back to sulfate and 'cone products and just deal with the annoyance of straightening my hair?

Help!
2B with 2A underlayer, very frizz-prone, low porosity, high density, fine/med thickness, high elasticity
I cut my hair -- from almost waist length up to armpit length!

Officially no longer CG --- my hair plays much nicer with sulfates as 'cones!
Shampoo: GTTTT, Aussie Aussomely Clean, L'Oreal EverSleek, YTCarrots
Clarify: Neutrogena Anti-Residue
R/O: CureCare, Suave Everlasting Sunshine, GVPCB
DT: L'Oreal Total Repair 5 Damage Erasing Balm
Current Stylers: Volumax, Ion
Some with lo-po hair find that it doesn't work too well to apply product to soaking wet hair. When it's that saturated with water, it can't absorb anything else, and so the product just sits there and builds up. You might try applying less product to hair that's only damp, and just see if that makes a difference. I don't know your products very well, but some have said that lo-po hair does better with lighter products that absorb more easily.

I'm not at ALL saying that it will be this simple, but it might be something to try just to see if it helps. GL!
Jessica
Type 2c: coarse, high-density, low porosity (so it would seem)
Avoiding protein and glycerin; going for soft, non-crunchy, frizz-free waves
CO & RO: Tresemme Naturals Moisture
Sealer: Olive oil
Leave-in/Styler: Kinky Curly Knot Today
DT: olive oil and honey
I have to put product on my hair as it dries. I keep stuff stashed in my car and my locker at work so I can touch up as needed. My hair takes a lot of product, but too much when wet makes it stringy. If I use oils and conditoners when wet, then let it dry about halfway to 3/4 then add my finishing products (cream, oil, gel) it is much better. But I always thought my hair is high porosity becuase it takes forever to dry. I guess I could be wrong though.
You might try a mousse. I love Moroccanoil curl control Mousse with a little BRHG and I have 2a/b hair too. I know someone else who tried the Marc Anthony Moroccan oil Mousse and had great success with it too. Also at least three waives like us I know have really gotten excited about the Deva Volumizing mousse.
And I too have way better luck scrunching or squeezing out the water out if my hair donuts not dropping before appointing product. Do you diffuse? And seriously you need to try more different products. If I had stuck only with the first things i tried I would not have ended up a happy camper.

Last edited by chupie; 08-20-2013 at 09:25 PM.
What are your dew points/ humidity? Are you 100% on your properties? Depending on budget it might be worth having a hair analysis, this new service is reasonably priced and you get microscope images. Someone on the Wavy Hair Community said it's better than Komaza Care. I'm not convinced LCLF is doing any more than a manual/ visual assessment.
Pedaheh's Hair Blog: GoosefootPrints Hair Analysis with My Analysis Results

Conditioning balm is not a deep conditioner since there is nothing that will penetrate, it's more of a moisturiser with propylene glycol as the second ingredient. There is also PG as the fourth ingredient in your Salon Care rinse out conditioner and that is a pretty potent humectant. There is aloe and agave in the KInky Curly, sorbitol and glycerin in your Fructis gel, all of which are humectants.

I have totally different hair to you but my hair does not like protein (weak humectant) with more potent humectants like PG, I get frizz. For some, the water attracted by humectants weigh the hair down.

Also shea butter can build up or weigh the hair down, maybe try a simpler gentle shampoo that cleanses but doesn't deposit. If you choose one based on cocoamidopropyl betaine you won't need to use sulphates - they can certainly make hair frizz if you are not using a leave in conditioner.

For many of us it's the leave in conditioner than aids the clumping and reduces frizz, styler alone makes for stringiness. If you are not using a depositing shampoo and humectant laden products you might be able to start using a protein rich leave in conditioner.

Magnesium sulphate (epsom salts) can boost waves without weighing the hair down.
2a-2c, medium texture, porous/ colour treated. Three years CG. Past bra strap length heading for waist.

CO-wash: Inecto coconut/ Elvive Volume Collagen
Treatments: Komaza Care Matani, coconut/ sweet almond oils, Hairveda Sitrinillah
Leave in: Fructis Sleek & Shine (old), Gliss Ultimate Volume, various Elvive
Styler: Umberto Giannini jelly, Boots Essentials gel
Flour sack towel, pixie diffuse or air dry.
Experimenting with: benign neglect
My hair is fine and on the lower end of the porosity spectrum so similar to yours.

I don't like using a lot of styling product - less is more in terms of amount as well as layers.

Some of my best hair days come from using plain FSG... with nothing under or over. My hair isn't weighed down, it definitely cuts down on frizz and feels moisturizing on me. I do very small clumps a lot of the time and sometime finger-comb after my hair is dry for bigger waves... but FSG works for bigger clumps as well depending on your preference.

I low-poo every other day and use a protein-packed rinse-out. I try to PT often. I almost never DT as my hair is never dry.

If your waves are falling out I wouldn't worry about it. I think a lot of wavies are trying to force their wave pattern and are "disappointed" when their waves/curls fall out at the end of the day. It's doesn't make sense to force it... you just have a different pattern so work with what you have. I would go away from concentrating on pattern and concentrating on frizz.

I don't know what's in the Salon Care Almond. KCCC is a tricky product to use and not suitable for high dews unless you use a hard hold gel on top... which may be too much for fine hair. I haven't tried the Garnier. The SM shampoo might be building up on your fine, low-porosity hair... think about alternating or switching to another low-poo like YesToCucumbers or Giovanni 50:50. Why are you doing DTs weekly? Is your hair dry? Only DT if you need it... otherwise fine hair can get overmoisturized/overconditioned easily.

And at the end of the day... if you wanna go back to silicone products because they were working for you, you can... but I don't know why that would mean going back to straightening or sulfates. A gentle low-poo with cocamidopropyl betaine or coco betaine can remove silicones... most low-poos have these ingredients and therefore can remove silicones (the SM ones cannot remove cones). 2A hair is in a lot of ways a lot easier to manage, if you just accept it for being swavy. A good leave-in conditioner (something like Renpure Brazilian Straigthening) alone or topped with a silicone serum should give you really silky waves and reduce frizz... don't worry about plopping and clipping. You can diffuse or blow-dry without the diffuser (on low-heat) or air dry. Keep up with protein because it's good for fine hair whether it's straight or curly. hope this helps.
fine - normal porosity*?- medium density - normal elasticity. Hard water. SoCal.
*Used to be low-porosity, but I lightened my hair 1-2 shades, so I may be normal-porosity now.

New climate! Current favorites:
Low-poo: CJ Gentle Cleansing Shampoo, Giovanni SaS
RO: V05 Kiwi Lime
Styler: UFD CM (old formula), FSG + CNPF
PT: CJ Repair Me, IAgirl's gelatine

Experimenting with: JC Confident Coils, JC Rockin Ringlets, CJ CIAB, gelatin gel

iherb discount code: CFN646
Thank you so much to everyone! I got more careful with looking at ingredients and switched out the products I was using... wow! After 1 shower I could immediately see a difference in my hair.

I changed my shampoo to the GTTTT, switched my condish to CureCare, which I also used as a L/I, and just used HETT gel. My hair felt super clean, super silky, and even in the shower my soaking-wet frizz was gone. I scrunched product into damp hair, squeezed out the extra water with a t-shirt, and air-dried without plopping or fussing too much. My waves aren't super strong/defined, but they're not really going to be, and accepting that I can just be a lovely swavy makes me *love* how my hair looks now. The only reason I have frizz now is because I couldn't stop fussing with my hair because it looked so nice, haha.

Thank you so much! I'll have to keep an eye on those humectants, butters, and oils from now on
wavydaze and JessMess like this.
2B with 2A underlayer, very frizz-prone, low porosity, high density, fine/med thickness, high elasticity
I cut my hair -- from almost waist length up to armpit length!

Officially no longer CG --- my hair plays much nicer with sulfates as 'cones!
Shampoo: GTTTT, Aussie Aussomely Clean, L'Oreal EverSleek, YTCarrots
Clarify: Neutrogena Anti-Residue
R/O: CureCare, Suave Everlasting Sunshine, GVPCB
DT: L'Oreal Total Repair 5 Damage Erasing Balm
Current Stylers: Volumax, Ion
That is great news!
2a-2c, medium texture, porous/ colour treated. Three years CG. Past bra strap length heading for waist.

CO-wash: Inecto coconut/ Elvive Volume Collagen
Treatments: Komaza Care Matani, coconut/ sweet almond oils, Hairveda Sitrinillah
Leave in: Fructis Sleek & Shine (old), Gliss Ultimate Volume, various Elvive
Styler: Umberto Giannini jelly, Boots Essentials gel
Flour sack towel, pixie diffuse or air dry.
Experimenting with: benign neglect
Jessica
Type 2c: coarse, high-density, low porosity (so it would seem)
Avoiding protein and glycerin; going for soft, non-crunchy, frizz-free waves
CO & RO: Tresemme Naturals Moisture
Sealer: Olive oil
Leave-in/Styler: Kinky Curly Knot Today
DT: olive oil and honey
Glad you got new results!

Just a note: for frizz, it's best to avoid humectants and glycerin products. I learned that in my research before I started.
Hair: 2c, maybe a bit 2b
High Porosity, High Denisty
Growing out my short asymmetrical bob and side bangs

Products:
-Trader Joe's Tea Tree Shampoo and Conditioner
-Leave- In spray that I made with : 1 tlspn of Suave Cocnut Condish and water
-Paul Mitchell's Flexible Style Sculpting Serum
-Herbal Essence Tousle Me Softly Mousse
-Tec-Italy Final Touch Gel (ingredients are CG friendly)

Mod CG start: 08/28/2013

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