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Old 08-23-2013, 02:45 PM   #1
 
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Default Have any wavies tried the Scott Musgrave way of styling wavy hair?

I stumbled upon this article on his blog: Wavy Hair | Scott Musgrave Hair

Has anyone tried this? What products did you use and what were your results?
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Old 08-23-2013, 02:51 PM   #2
 
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I have. And I continue to use it in various ways. It really works for me. I also believe it's principle of filling and sealing are probably why some find success with other techniques like scrunch and pump. I was going to do a video demonstrating how I interpreted this MAP method this weekend. I'll post a link here when it's finished.
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Old 08-23-2013, 04:56 PM   #3
 
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I'd like to try this method but to be honest, I am finding it hard to understand what he is saying. Can someone give me the Cliff Notes version?

It would be appreciated!
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Old 08-23-2013, 05:51 PM   #4
 
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This is 5 layers of products..... This kind of thing really irks me. Is it really necessary to use 5 layers of products? I really want this CG thing to work but I really don't have the money to keep spending like this. I don't understand why there aren't products out there that do the job of 5 layers... I understand 2 layers or even 3 but 5... come on. [/rant]
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Cowash: CJ Daily Fix
Low-poo: CJ Gentle Cleansing Shampoo, Giovanni 2chic BK&AO
RO: TN Radiant Care, Giovanni SaS, Ogx BKT*, Sukin Nourishing, SS Caitlin's, various
LI: sometimes TN Radiant Care
Styler: FSG with CNPF, CJ Pattern Pusha, Volumax Mega, Ouidad Climate Control*, Ogx BKT serum*
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Old 08-23-2013, 06:05 PM   #5
 
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This is 5 layers of products..... This kind of thing really irks me. Is it really necessary to use 5 layers of products? I really want this CG thing to work but I really don't have the money to keep spending like this. I don't understand why there aren't products out there that do the job of 5 layers... I understand 2 layers or even 3 but 5... come on. [/rant]
I'm not sure where you see 5 layers of product. It's one product as a filler and a second product as a sealer (with leave-in).
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Modified CG since 11/5/11
CO-WASH: VO5 Vanilla Mint Tea Clarifying, DevaCare No-Poo
CLARIFY: CHS Treatment Shampoo (used prior to PT/DT)
RO: DevaCare One Condition, Regis Olive Oil
LI: Cure Care, As I Am Leave-In
STYLE: Re:Coil, Curl Keeper, Biotera Gel, Deva Ultra Defining Gel, GVP Liquid Sculpting Gel, Curls Rock Amplifier and Strong Hold Mousse
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Old 08-23-2013, 06:15 PM   #6
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wavydaze View Post
This is 5 layers of products..... This kind of thing really irks me. Is it really necessary to use 5 layers of products? I really want this CG thing to work but I really don't have the money to keep spending like this. I don't understand why there aren't products out there that do the job of 5 layers... I understand 2 layers or even 3 but 5... come on. [/rant]
I'm not sure where you see 5 layers of product. It's one product as a filler and a second product as a sealer (with leave-in).
This.
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Old 08-23-2013, 06:34 PM   #7
 
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I'd like to try this method but to be honest, I am finding it hard to understand what he is saying. Can someone give me the Cliff Notes version?

It would be appreciated!
I find his writing style kind of confusing too... I had to reread the article several times and I kept it open to refer to as I styled.

Here's what I did...

Standing upright, I squeezed out some water with my hands. I then raked in a nickel size of One Condition as a LI. I concentrated it in the bottom 3/4 of my hair but also raked from roots to ends after it was mostly in. I squeezed various sections. I then repeated this process with 2 pumps of B'Leave In.

I flipped my head over and scrunched with my hands a bit. I also ruffled my roots.

I then took a quarter size of gel (LALSG), rubbed it between my hands, put my hands in an open finger comb position, and squeezed the product from roots to ends in various places (basically gripping chunks between my fingers and scrunching together and upwards). I then took another quarter size of gel, grabbed all of my hair at once, and scrunched upwards. I continued scrunching the gel into my lengths upside down and leaning side to side.

I continued scrunching with my hands a lot. I then used a t shirt and scrunched and held sections for 15-20 seconds each. I did this upside working around my head, side to side, and upright.

I positioned my hair and clipped up my roots. I then divided my hair into 2 sections (left and right). I piled each side in the diffuser (while it was turned off) and diffused low heat low air for 2 minutes each. I did a small section in the back for about a minute then the roots and sides of my crown for an additional minute or so.


This is just how I interpreted it... I could be totally off.
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Old 08-23-2013, 08:02 PM   #8
 
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I just generally have taken to squeezing. Squeezing in my conditioner before rinsing out. Taking my leave in (SMCES of late) and raking it along the bottom portion of the length and squeezing along the shaft and then I scrunch a little.

THen take the filler (FSG, JCCC or JC RR, B'leave In, SSCEJ anything that would have been the second layer, just as always) and rake and squeeze along the length, but not much above the ears (he specifies that but for me it makes sense, that is my most porous and also where my wave is, I don't have a bunch of root curl), then scrunch a little to get wave going.

Then take my over gel (usually BRHG, but could be UDG or AA whatever you normally use as your "hold") and I again rake and squeeze along the shaft and you can go a little higher than where you started the filler, or all the way to the root if you have root wave or do your styling upside down (yes, that squeezes out the wave, but this seems to work) and then scrunch (Sometimes hand, sometimes towel, depending on how wet my hair is) until I get the wave as I like it. The wave comes back, it really does. Then diffuse as usual.

You can adapt this to what works for you. And, maybe if you have normal or low porosity, it may not work or work as well as another technique. But for me it does quite well. As I said, I think the mechanics are similar to why scrunch and pump works, or smastering. It evens distribution and also fills the shaft with a moisturizing filler so the shaft hangs on to that moisture better.

Now, You may also have to adjust by weight. Finer hair maybe needs light fillers like FSG or maybe use a spray gel if that works. Scott has also mentioned using a cream as filler, and mousse as the sealer, because it has some hold properties. Interestingly, the best benefit I have seen is easier to refresh, better second day hair. It just doesn't seem to take as much for me to regenerate definition.

It's honestly not totally different from what people in general do now. It's just a guideline to be extended and adjusted, maybe help you see how your hair behaves. Some of this is making sense to me because of the thread on here about moisture and conditioning. I finally get what the balance thing is about.

One last thought is that this may help frizz as you aren't immediately shoving the hair shaft up with product, pushing lighter fly-away hair up and away from its home. It gives you a chance to attach it to the pack with the squeezing along the shaft before you scrunch. I think it is also very similar to very wavy wavies or real curlies who take product and really smooth it down a whole clump of hair, actually pulling and elongating before they scrunch. They can do that because they have such strong patters. I think pulling as opposed to just squeezing down the shaft would be harder for a lot of us wavies to bounce back from, but I would guess this acts in a similar functional manner.

I think this technique may work a little more like molding and giving structure to our weaker wavy hair, with the gel cast as the same function of holding it there. I suspect second day hair is even better in some ways, because the filler/sealer method has kept the shaft more moisturized, hanging on to water. I will say, I have medium width (more on the fine than coarse side, but still medium) with medium density. I can probably hand a little more weight than some gossamer fine peeps. And yet I see a lot of fine hairs who can use stuff that no way can I use! KCCC, or gobs more product than I use.

So much of this still depends on experimentation. Finding what works for you. But this is another idea to try. Again, it's not so different than scrunch and pump, but just another method of distribution that may or may not work. I have found things out from trying it that definitely assist me in a better wave pattern.

I did this very thing this morning on second day hair, only wetting and rinsing the length because my crown was fine and I didn't want a whole wet head. I used SMCES as LI, CJPP (my first time using it) as filler and topped with BRHG. Help up awesome all day. The first pic was this morning and the second at the end of the day.
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Have any wavies tried the Scott Musgrave way of styling wavy hair?-img_4212.jpg   Have any wavies tried the Scott Musgrave way of styling wavy hair?-img_4227.jpg  
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Old 08-23-2013, 09:09 PM   #9
 
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So the 'squeezing' is where I get lost - I just can't visualize what that means. Post that vid, Chupie
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Old 08-23-2013, 09:26 PM   #10
 
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I have to make it first! I just rake the filler through a section, downward from about ear level (top of ear) and then go back and gently squeeze down that section of hair too. Does that make sense?
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Old 08-23-2013, 10:45 PM   #11
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Corrina777 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by wavydaze View Post
This is 5 layers of products..... This kind of thing really irks me. Is it really necessary to use 5 layers of products? I really want this CG thing to work but I really don't have the money to keep spending like this. I don't understand why there aren't products out there that do the job of 5 layers... I understand 2 layers or even 3 but 5... come on. [/rant]
I'm not sure where you see 5 layers of product. It's one product as a filler and a second product as a sealer (with leave-in).
1. 5 cent size leave-in
2. Deva B'leavein
3. Jessicurl Gelebration spray
4. UDG or Volumizing foam
5. Jessicurl confident coils

^although is it 2 or 3, and 4 or 5? I went through it as a step by step
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fine - low porosity - medium density - normal elasticity. Very high dews. Soft water.

Cowash: CJ Daily Fix
Low-poo: CJ Gentle Cleansing Shampoo, Giovanni 2chic BK&AO
RO: TN Radiant Care, Giovanni SaS, Ogx BKT*, Sukin Nourishing, SS Caitlin's, various
LI: sometimes TN Radiant Care
Styler: FSG with CNPF, CJ Pattern Pusha, Volumax Mega, Ouidad Climate Control*, Ogx BKT serum*
PT: CJ Repair Me, IAgirl's gelatine

*have cones
underline = I love these!

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Old 08-23-2013, 11:01 PM   #12
 
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Originally Posted by wavydaze View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Corrina777 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by wavydaze View Post
This is 5 layers of products..... This kind of thing really irks me. Is it really necessary to use 5 layers of products? I really want this CG thing to work but I really don't have the money to keep spending like this. I don't understand why there aren't products out there that do the job of 5 layers... I understand 2 layers or even 3 but 5... come on. [/rant]
I'm not sure where you see 5 layers of product. It's one product as a filler and a second product as a sealer (with leave-in).
1. 5 cent size leave-in
2. Deva B'leavein
3. Jessicurl Gelebration spray
4. UDG or Volumizing foam
5. Jessicurl confident coils

^although is it 2 or 3, and 4 or 5? I went through it as a step by step
He just suggests products... LI, b'leave in, and gelebration are examples of fillers. The others are sealers. You're supposed to pick 1 filler + 1 sealer (though I did a LI then 1 of each). For example.. B'leave in + UDG.
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Old 08-24-2013, 01:16 AM   #13
 
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Originally Posted by wavydaze View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Corrina777 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by wavydaze View Post
This is 5 layers of products..... This kind of thing really irks me. Is it really necessary to use 5 layers of products? I really want this CG thing to work but I really don't have the money to keep spending like this. I don't understand why there aren't products out there that do the job of 5 layers... I understand 2 layers or even 3 but 5... come on. [/rant]
I'm not sure where you see 5 layers of product. It's one product as a filler and a second product as a sealer (with leave-in).
1. 5 cent size leave-in
2. Deva B'leavein
3. Jessicurl Gelebration spray
4. UDG or Volumizing foam
5. Jessicurl confident coils

^although is it 2 or 3, and 4 or 5? I went through it as a step by step
Scott regularly works with both the Deva products and Jessicurl products, so he gives examples from each product line. He also expanded on this a bit during his FB Q&A to explain fillers vs sealers so that MAP can be applied with other products.
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Modified CG since 11/5/11
CO-WASH: VO5 Vanilla Mint Tea Clarifying, DevaCare No-Poo
CLARIFY: CHS Treatment Shampoo (used prior to PT/DT)
RO: DevaCare One Condition, Regis Olive Oil
LI: Cure Care, As I Am Leave-In
STYLE: Re:Coil, Curl Keeper, Biotera Gel, Deva Ultra Defining Gel, GVP Liquid Sculpting Gel, Curls Rock Amplifier and Strong Hold Mousse
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Old 08-24-2013, 02:09 AM   #14
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Corrina777 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by wavydaze View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Corrina777 View Post

I'm not sure where you see 5 layers of product. It's one product as a filler and a second product as a sealer (with leave-in).
1. 5 cent size leave-in
2. Deva B'leavein
3. Jessicurl Gelebration spray
4. UDG or Volumizing foam
5. Jessicurl confident coils

^although is it 2 or 3, and 4 or 5? I went through it as a step by step
Scott regularly works with both the Deva products and Jessicurl products, so he gives examples from each product line. He also expanded on this a bit during his FB Q&A to explain fillers vs sealers so that MAP can be applied with other products.
Could you link me to the Q&A please? I'd love to read it but can't seem to find it.
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Old 08-24-2013, 05:26 AM   #15
 
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Originally Posted by kaykre View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Corrina777 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by wavydaze View Post

1. 5 cent size leave-in
2. Deva B'leavein
3. Jessicurl Gelebration spray
4. UDG or Volumizing foam
5. Jessicurl confident coils

^although is it 2 or 3, and 4 or 5? I went through it as a step by step
Scott regularly works with both the Deva products and Jessicurl products, so he gives examples from each product line. He also expanded on this a bit during his FB Q&A to explain fillers vs sealers so that MAP can be applied with other products.
Could you link me to the Q&A please? I'd love to read it but can't seem to find it.
The discussions are on this page:

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Curly...80049318688973

Scott had two sessions, so there are two different threads for him. Two other stylists also have live Q&A threads, so there's ton's of useful info. And I believe Scott was also talking about creating a video. One of the other stylists posted a video for a method that looked really interesting. If you have the time, I would suggest reading through all four threads.

I also have to say that I get good results with this method- it's very similar to what I've been doing, but the small changes that I've made have led to huge improvements in results.
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3a/f/iii Before the chop- Donated to Locks of Love, January 2013
Modified CG since 11/5/11
CO-WASH: VO5 Vanilla Mint Tea Clarifying, DevaCare No-Poo
CLARIFY: CHS Treatment Shampoo (used prior to PT/DT)
RO: DevaCare One Condition, Regis Olive Oil
LI: Cure Care, As I Am Leave-In
STYLE: Re:Coil, Curl Keeper, Biotera Gel, Deva Ultra Defining Gel, GVP Liquid Sculpting Gel, Curls Rock Amplifier and Strong Hold Mousse
PT/DT: IAGirl's PT, One n' Only Argan Hydrating Mask
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Old 08-24-2013, 05:02 PM   #16
 
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Thanks!
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Old 08-24-2013, 08:59 PM   #17
 
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His method is, essentially, what I've been doing for the past several months and having great results with.

I always cowash/poo then follow with a rich RO in the shower.
Usually I do not use a LI.
Always use a slimy curl enhancer ("filler")
followed by a gel ("sealer")
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Old 08-24-2013, 10:10 PM   #18
 
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Originally Posted by chloe92us View Post
His method is, essentially, what I've been doing for the past several months and having great results with.

I always cowash/poo then follow with a rich RO in the shower.
Usually I do not use a LI.
Always use a slimy curl enhancer ("filler")
followed by a gel ("sealer")
Do you find your hair ever gets dried out from skipping LI? Or does the rich RO take care of that?
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Old 08-25-2013, 06:22 AM   #19
 
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[

Do you find your hair ever gets dried out from skipping LI? Or does the rich RO take care of that?
My hair rarely feels dry anymore- I think I finally have the moisture/ protein balance right.

But you have to remember I live in an extremely humid environment....so that helps. I use a leave in about 2x a week, though.

It depends on what stylers I plan on using that day. I now use a leave in mainly to combat the extreme crunch from some gels.
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Old 08-25-2013, 11:21 PM   #20
 
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Hey ladies im still having trouble finding the Q and A with scott. I followed the link above to facebook but now i dont know where to find it. Sorry im not so good with the computers! Thank you
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