Thanks for the reply. I have been testing strands of my hair all night and I seem to get mixed results and I don't know if it's truly mixed or if the slight changes in my technique are all that change. Sometimes if I barely stretch it, and focus I can FEEL it shrink back once I ease up, but usually I can barely stretch it to do this. I definitely don't know how I would estimate how much it stretched since I can't see it, but more so feel it. I wonder if fine hair is just hard to get a read on for this.

I go back and forth I guess... some days I feel it's soft and overly moisturized, and then I feel it and think hmm... maybe that's dry. I really need a clump of each type of hair to compare it to I think rofl. It is like you said though... poofy and frizzy so it has a dry appearance and lack of shine because nothing is together.

I got desperate tonight and combed it out, which left it pretty flat. Then on a whim I took some of my biolage sealing leave in (which I had stopped using due to cones) and put that on my dry hair and then rewet it with my hands raking through. Figured I had F'd it up for the day and would start over tomorrow but I was just trying to make it soft. Low and behold... as it dried I had more curl and definition than earlier lol. I think I just need to go ahead and order some okra gel like I planned and try adding that over a leave in to see if getting that definition and some hold makes a difference. The trouble was I wanted to do a customized one and now I am so confused I don't want to misinterpret my hair and get the wrong additives. I just didn't want to use the very basic one since I wanted to love it for my hair.

I just got YTC and planned to use that as a RO and LI most days maybe switching back and forth with my regular biolage conditioning balm. Then for a low poo I was using Alba something or other that has protein, but it also has cones which I didn't realize until after buying it. Maybe the cones in that are causing build up, but I just cleansed so I dunno. Maybe I will just keep using those things for a bit and see how it is in a few days, and like I said order that stuff. I think the YTC is protein free, but when I researched it people said it helped lock in protein or something maybe. I suppose that could be wrong. There is just too much to think about!
Originally Posted by awelcome
My other suggestion was going to be to check your products for glycerin and try avoiding that in your leave-ins and stylers but it appears your good on that. I agree with Chloe92us about needing product to smooth/define/de-frizz, I've tried condish only styling and my hair still gets poofy. I definitely need at least a light hold gel or jelly to keep frizz away. I've been using DermOrganics spray gel for the days I want to go 'product-free', its light and easy to comb out but makes my hair smooth, I don't get the nice tight waves I can with the hard hold gel but its a trade off for hair I can run my hands thru for a day or two. I found the DO spray gel at Marshalls for ten bucks, I also tried the Pantene curly spray gel, if I remember correctly it was a little harder to get my fingers through but still, one of those might hold you over till you get the okra gel. I generally apply the DO to dry hair, I spray it on wet hands and smooth/rake through and let air dry. YMMV
2A / F / MD / LP / ?E / BSL --- CG since Dec. 2012

This is what I'm happiest with right now.
Co-wash: CJ DailyFix
Lo-poo: DermOrganic low-poo
RO: SS Caitlin's co
Leave-in: SheScentIt Okra Repair condish
PT: SS Caitlin's + SS PT
Stylers: Volumax Mega Gel, Max Green Styling Gel, DermOrganics Spray Gel
Techniques: Plopping & Pixie Diffusing.
glycerin, honey, oils & butters Protein!