Curl Pattern 3d - Am I the only one who thinks there is a missing link?

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nobody has "good hair"unless they take care of it "good" i dont really understand where that saying really came from.. everyones hair is pretty to me as long as its in healthy condition. as for the typing i dont necessarily agree with it but adding a new one sounds good to me! it would help those inbetweeners out there lol call it whatever you want. i just like the fact that i have curly hair
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Well really Im pretty sure they (im not sure who they are )but someone just came up with the 2a-4c hair types because they wanted us curlies to use it as a reference... Most people dont have dead on 3c hair or 4b hair... whatever we just choose the type that has the most similar characteristics and properties as our own hair.


Now I must say I am a person who believes in freedom of speech and everyone deserves to have an opinion but some opinions I feel can be a bit out of line, to the first curly who made the remark about the making up a curl pattern and so on I feel you have the right to express your opinion however I felt like you were indirectly attacking the person who made this thread and no matter how nicely you may put something doesnt mean its not going to have the same affect as if you were to state your opinion directly. I feel that the woman who posted her thread really felt that she had in between hair types and you should have accepted and RESPECTED that.

I am not a "lets make love /peace not war" person but I feel that we should be able to express our thoughts and opinions without being disrespectful we deal with enough drama in our daily lives we should be able to come on this forum and discuss this thing we call hair and other subjects correctly but then this is naiive for me to think since this forum contains thousands of active members with a blend of different personalities

Finished with my rant

P.s sorry to the original individual who posted this thread I get where youre coming from and there is nothing wrong with what you said
Oh geez... Here we go again.
Why can't we just get along. If she wants to catagorize her hair as 3D why does it have to indicate she doesn't like kinky hair. Why can't it be that she can't find where she fits in that funky system and thinks there should be another catagory. Andre Walkers original system didn't even include 3C or 4C. I recall reading about 3C right here on NC in a sticky a few years ago. Why, because people didn't feel they were a 3B or a 4A so 3C was born. Same with 4C.
I know for some this natural hair thing is a political statement, but it isn't for all of us. Some just like the way their hair looks, some were tired of being a slave to a salon, some wanted healthier hair, some wanted longer hair, some just wanted to jump on the bandwagon, and a multitude of other reasons. And for some it's a political statement.
We shouldn't assume that her reason for suggesting a new category was anything other then what she indicated. IMO it is usually better to take a person at face value until actions or words indicate otherwise. I have found that when I make assumptions not based on fact or actions or words, it's my issue and not theirs.
It sounds to me like she had an idea that she wanted to share.
Originally Posted by curlspeak
I could not agree with you any more you took the words from my mouth ... She did not petition to make a new hair category it was innocent what she did, for her 3c/4a=3d so what and I just did not agree that korkscrew said "there was an elephant in the room that she was pointing out" because none of us know this woman personally and why she wanted to classify herself as 3d
I just did not agree that korkscrew said "there was an elephant in the room that she was pointing out" because none of us know this woman personally and why she wanted to classify herself as 3d
Originally Posted by tenapaige
Yeah, your ad hominem attack is ill-placed. My initial response was conceptual, not personal; a response to the OP's question in a general sense, not re: her possible motivation. Can't read people's minds, thank God. After a minute I imagine it would feel like being poached alive in the boiling seas of Hell.

1. I noted my opinion that a "3d" category is impractical and redundant, in direct response to the OP's question.

2. Noted that, in addition to impracticality, SOME people (I've witnessed and heard about) act out a "good hair/bad hair" complex with the "3d" category.

The "elephant in the room" (#2) is what I felt wasn't being acknowledged. I never targeted anyone in this thread as having the "good hair / bad hair" complex of which I speak.

Unless someone fits into the sub-category of people who have the insecurity complex I speak of, I have no idea why there would be a defensive reaction to me simply noting the fact of the existence of the complex.

3. i acknowledged that people get to label their hair whatever they'd like, my personal observations and thoughts be damned.
3b/c?

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I think that there should be a 3d category. It's almost like 2c in with wavy hair, where its not *quite* curly like a complete 3a but much more so than 2b.
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There are some people that constantly feel the need to talk about a "good hair/bad hair" complex when the majority of posts on curltalk are about people that love their hair but want to improve the frizz, porosity, feel etc. I do not see people complaining on this site very often about having bad hair vs. good hair. Perhaps I'm not on here enough. I don't know. But there's one person I've noticed now and in the past that constantly talks about it. I personally think the typing stuff is worthless, but there are a lot of people that don't. And, like I said before some people do not think their hair fits neatly into the categories. So what if they want to be a 3d. They're probably 3c/4a, but do not feel it fits that. I don't know. It just seems odd that some people will accuse this young lady or others of having this complex. This person may genuinely feel she does not fit a 3c or 4a.
I'd rather edit than be rude.

Last edited by Kilajo; 10-10-2012 at 03:47 PM.
My "behavior" was typing my opinion of what you said. Since we're characterizing each other's behavior, yours seems to be that of insecurity. How dare these 4s call themselves 3s.
Originally Posted by Kilajo
Interesting interpretation and I don't see that statement you're making "How dare you ..." as facetious, or even dialectical. You misunderstand: I've twice now said anyone is free to label/mislabel themselves. I've also twice stated a fact about some of the "good-hair"/"bad hair" dynamic that plays itself out via dissociation with 4 hair. If you're never heard or this happening, or you've never witnessed someone doing it, so be it. I have. We simply have different experiences and/or opinions on the matter. Nothing to get up in arms about, really. I'm not pointing to every 4, or you.


The 4s I see on here all seem to accept their natural curls. Why shouldn't they!? Tightly coiled hair is beautiful!
I agree that people should accept their natural curls. And I fully agree that tightly coiled hair is beautiful (just a gorgeous as any other type of curl). But that's not what society teaches people and you see THAT is why there are some coily girls - not all - who have a hard time fully accepting it (on or offline).

As usual, the truth is somewhere in the middle: there are people who love their coils, others who are Okay with them, and some who are in denial and have issues. To pretend this last mindset doesn't exist ... I'm just not sure what to tell you.

I think you are disingenuous by repeatedly posting about 4s having this complex ...
I've repeated my original point in order to respond to your reaction to it, otherwise I've stated it once. There's no logical reason for demonizing the content of what anyone said when it's perfectly factual. Shooting the messenger is pointless.
Originally Posted by Korkscrew
The interesting thing is that I have never seen you go on the wavy board and complain about wavies secretly wanting tighter curls. I have seen some wavies complain about weak waves and wanting curlier hair. Where is your response?? I also have never seen you talk about curlies secretly wanting looser or tighter curls. I have seen some people complain about that as well. Perhaps I missed your posts on that? The only thing you repeat time and again is this good hair/bad hair issue that you say some tightly curly people have (ie 4s.) That is the only thing you seem to take issue with. I wonder why that is so important to you but these other issues are not... Hmm.
There are some people that constantly feel the need to talk about a "good hair/bad hair" complex ...
Originally Posted by Kilajo
I mentioned it once at the start of this thread, only responding later because you wished to debate it. Not sure who those people are you're talking about, nor do I care if anyone decides they want to talk about any particular topic at length, on a talk forum.

The interesting thing is that I have never seen you go on the wavy board and complain about wavies secretly wanting tighter curls ...
Originally Posted by Kilajo
I have curly, not wavy or straight, hair and therefore don't tend to visit that area of NC. ... And in my personal experience, it is indeed certain curlies who most often struggle with a racially-charged "good hair/ bad hair" complex. You might not be aware of this problem, but I am, and stated as much. Sorry you've inexplicably taken it personally.
3b/c?

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lol

Last edited by Kilajo; 10-10-2012 at 08:09 PM.
I've seen you do this in other threads as well ...
Originally Posted by Kilajo
Didn't read past this point because I don't entertain ad hominem attacks in place of objectively arguing the topic at hand.
3b/c?

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I've seen you do this in other threads as well ...
Originally Posted by Kilajo
Didn't read past this point because I don't entertain ad hominem attacks in place of objectively arguing the topic at hand.
Originally Posted by Korkscrew
Now how did I guess you would respond. Let's see how long this continues.

Last edited by Kilajo; 10-10-2012 at 07:36 PM.
What happened to this thread? The OP was just asking a simple question, and I seriously doubt that she had the "good hair/bad hair" concept in her mind. As an African American young woman myself, I notice that most of us do tend to degrade our hair types, unfortunately. Specifically, it is the so called "kinky" hair type or "type 4." But again, it was a simple post. There was no "I'm trying to create another hair type because I don't want to put myself in the 4 category" undertone to the question. Korkscrew, I believe it was you who implied the whole "good hair/bad hair" concept. While I understand your point of view, the OP could have taken that as an attack to her motive for creating the thread. But you cleared that up, thankfully. To Kilajo, in your last post, you stated that you knew Korkscrew would respond, but by saying that, you have just encouraged her to say something in return. Why does this matter so much to you? Why did her "good hair/bad hair" comment affect to to that degree?

Ladies, you are both entitled to your opinions and this "healthy debate," but even debates have to end somewhere. I am not trying to bash either of you, but you are making something as insignificant as curl types into a big ordeal. Sadly, it does not seem like this debate will end until one of you gets the last word. Does anyone realize that the OP hasn't been on here? That she hasn't said anything?

(Disclaimer: this is my honest opinion)
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Elizabeth,

We have a different opinion about the OP's topic and that's fine. As to the thread drama, I simply restated an opinion based on fact (over and over). The vitriol was manufactured by Kilajo - an onslaught of off-topic ad hominem attacks were launched two posts ago, that s/he edited out to replace with "lol", which she might still nervously edit again. She also made a groundless accusation about "getting the last word", etc. And so it went, on and on, like a bad train wreck.

Yes, the OP is long gone, and since K can't address the topic with a cool head, and because she has resorted to childish personal attacks, I'm disengaging from this thread, so s/he indeed will be closing the thread (if s/he wants to). Maybe that will calm her down some. If so, great.
3b/c?

Ringlet Fandango! ... Where curly ideas roam free

* 2 blogs this week: Pictures of My (Sorta) Big Chop! AND Turn a Nightmare Product into a Dream* My Albums
The last thing I am Korkscrew is nervous. There you go again projecting your anxieties onto someone else. You brought this thread back to life after 9 or so months. You restarted this long dead debate. Yes, I knew you would respond because that's what you do. That's your mo...to get the last word. It wouldn't have mattered what I said. I said what I said to see if you would take the bait and true to form you did...
What happened to this thread? The OP was just asking a simple question, and I seriously doubt that she had the "good hair/bad hair" concept in her mind. As an African American young woman myself, I notice that most of us do tend to degrade our hair types, unfortunately. Specifically, it is the so called "kinky" hair type or "type 4." But again, it was a simple post. There was no "I'm trying to create another hair type because I don't want to put myself in the 4 category" undertone to the question. Korkscrew, I believe it was you who implied the whole "good hair/bad hair" concept. While I understand your point of view, the OP could have taken that as an attack to her motive for creating the thread. But you cleared that up, thankfully. To Kilajo, in your last post, you stated that you knew Korkscrew would respond, but by saying that, you have just encouraged her to say something in return. Why does this matter so much to you? Why did her "good hair/bad hair" comment affect to to that degree?

Ladies, you are both entitled to your opinions and this "healthy debate," but even debates have to end somewhere. I am not trying to bash either of you, but you are making something as insignificant as curl types into a big ordeal. Sadly, it does not seem like this debate will end until one of you gets the last word. Does anyone realize that the OP hasn't been on here? That she hasn't said anything?

(Disclaimer: this is my honest opinion)
Originally Posted by ElizabethFaith
The good hair/bad hair debate is not the issue. It's the fact that she brought up this long dead thread and began her attack all over again. I'm simply playing her little game with her. It's amusing to me.
What happened to this thread? The OP was just asking a simple question, and I seriously doubt that she had the "good hair/bad hair" concept in her mind. As an African American young woman myself, I notice that most of us do tend to degrade our hair types, unfortunately. Specifically, it is the so called "kinky" hair type or "type 4." But again, it was a simple post. There was no "I'm trying to create another hair type because I don't want to put myself in the 4 category" undertone to the question. Korkscrew, I believe it was you who implied the whole "good hair/bad hair" concept. While I understand your point of view, the OP could have taken that as an attack to her motive for creating the thread. But you cleared that up, thankfully. To Kilajo, in your last post, you stated that you knew Korkscrew would respond, but by saying that, you have just encouraged her to say something in return. Why does this matter so much to you? Why did her "good hair/bad hair" comment affect to to that degree?

Ladies, you are both entitled to your opinions and this "healthy debate," but even debates have to end somewhere. I am not trying to bash either of you, but you are making something as insignificant as curl types into a big ordeal. Sadly, it does not seem like this debate will end until one of you gets the last word. Does anyone realize that the OP hasn't been on here? That she hasn't said anything?

(Disclaimer: this is my honest opinion)
Originally Posted by ElizabethFaith
Omg thankyouuuuu and thats what Ive been trying to say, but I've found korkscrew is just a person who likes a debate I just replied to someone elses post on another topic and she felt the need to disagree with me on something I said
but why.
Originally Posted by murrrcat
And what for.
murrrcat likes this.

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