Hair Products and Their Bases - Page 2

Nappy_curly_crown · 10-07-2010, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Naturalista

Quote:

Originally Posted by hippychic

Quote:

Originally Posted by finehair

I think Mala uses a base for her butters too.
Only thing different in her butters are the oils/essential oil blend she uses.

fine hair, you've just hit pay dirt!!!

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat!? Hehe!! Makes folks wanna start googling ingredient combos to see what pops up...

I'm already on it.

EllyEllyOxenFree · 10-07-2010, 12:30 PM

I'm about to have a ball on EW... Brendita also uses the Silk Creme for her hair pudding. Want.

Naturalista · 10-07-2010, 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ellepixie

I'm about to have a ball on EW... Bredita also uses the Silk Creme for her hair pudding. Want.

Love EW.. but the shipping kills a lil, but the fact that you can bulk buy and it last a while makes it worth it.

EllyEllyOxenFree · 10-07-2010, 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Naturalista

Quote:

Originally Posted by ellepixie

I'm about to have a ball on EW... Bredita also uses the Silk Creme for her hair pudding. Want.

Love EW.. but the shipping kills a lil, but the fact that you can bulk buy and it last a while makes it worth it.

Maybe it's my location, but I have 5 things in my cart that equal 5lbs and $50, and my shipping is $11.73. Isn't that pretty standard with a lot of the orders we make?

sassywillow · 10-07-2010, 12:38 PM

The Prana conditioner and the BARE conditioner are bases. I did a google on the ingredients minus the herbs and oils and I found several conditioners out there with the same exact base. What is disturbing is that Mala lists an ingredient called silica. In the other products with the same base this ingredient is listed as Dimethicone (from Silica). Does this mean that her conditoners have a cone in them and she is misleading customers???

EllyEllyOxenFree · 10-07-2010, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sassywillow

The Prana conditioner and the BARE conditioner are bases. I did a google on the ingredients minus the herbs and oils and I found several conditioners out there with the same exact base. What is disturbing is that Mala lists an ingredient called silica. In the other products with the same base this ingredient is listed as Dimethicone (from Silica). Does this mean that her conditoners have a cone in them and she is misleading customers???

No, silica is good for hair, it's like horsetail - a strengthener. Can you list the ingredients though for the base? She might be...

artemis · 10-07-2010, 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nappy_curly_crown

Plus there is a difference between "private label agreements" and companies selling the same product manufactured in the same facility under different brands with different price points. Private label agreements are when a formulator stikes a deal with someone what a manufacturing facility to mass product a product for them. The formulator retains EXCLUSIVE rights to the formula, and the owner of the facility gets a flat manufacturing payment.

+1. Plus, a dry blend containing fatty alcohols and an emulsifier isn't a base per se. You have to add the water, oils, herbs, preservative, etc yourself making it a unique formula. Bulk liquid, cream and butter bases are pre-fabricated formulas that already contain all the water, oils, herbs, preservative, etc needed. The customer only needs to add scent to finish. Naturmulse is an emulsifier like BTMS and a million others out there which every emulsion needs, commercial or handmade. Without an emulsifier the product will separate.

Nappy_curly_crown · 10-07-2010, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sassywillow

The Prana conditioner and the BARE conditioner are bases. I did a google on the ingredients minus the herbs and oils and I found several conditioners out there with the same exact base. What is disturbing is that Mala lists an ingredient called silica. In the other products with the same base this ingredient is listed as Dimethicone (from Silica). Does this mean that her conditoners have a cone in them and she is misleading customers???

I pretty much figured that the entire "bare" line was nothing but bases. I never tried the Prana so I dunno the deal with that. The only thing I liked from her was the butters. If I find the base for them its OVER -------------> She might as well file chapter 13 and take down her shingle!

Nappy_curly_crown · 10-07-2010, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ellepixie

Quote:

Originally Posted by sassywillow

The Prana conditioner and the BARE conditioner are bases. I did a google on the ingredients minus the herbs and oils and I found several conditioners out there with the same exact base. What is disturbing is that Mala lists an ingredient called silica. In the other products with the same base this ingredient is listed as Dimethicone (from Silica). Does this mean that her conditoners have a cone in them and she is misleading customers???

No, silica is good for hair, it's like horsetail - a strengthener. Can you list the ingredients though for the base? She might be...

Found it. Here's the link to the conditioner base

EllyEllyOxenFree · 10-07-2010, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nappy_curly_crown

Quote:

Originally Posted by ellepixie

Quote:

Originally Posted by sassywillow

The Prana conditioner and the BARE conditioner are bases. I did a google on the ingredients minus the herbs and oils and I found several conditioners out there with the same exact base. What is disturbing is that Mala lists an ingredient called silica. In the other products with the same base this ingredient is listed as Dimethicone (from Silica). Does this mean that her conditoners have a cone in them and she is misleading customers???

No, silica is good for hair, it's like horsetail - a strengthener. Can you list the ingredients though for the base? She might be...

Found it. Here's the link to the conditioner base

OMG...well if that is what she uses she is DEF lyin' to folks, because dimethicone and silica are not the same thing. Oooohhh

afrosheenqueen · 10-07-2010, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nappy_curly_crown

Quote:

Originally Posted by afrosheenqueen

Afroveda's Holy Basil, Coconut Moisture, Neem, Kissi, Nu Milk, and Emu are made from this base. You can add ingredients or herbs as you like. http://www.ingredientstodiefor.com/i...category_id=53

Her other conditioners are from the Cetyl Alcohol, Stearyl Alcohol (together these are called Cetearyl, the name she uses), Stearalkonium Chloride, Dimethyl Stearamine, Lactic Acid type of base I mentioned above.

Mala also gets NatureMulse, the emulsifier she uses for her butters, from here as well. I bought some to experiment with.

Wait a dayum minute. You mean to tell me this heffa using BASES and trying to charge these high ass high end product prices?!?!?!? OH HELL TO THE NAW.

The link I gave above in my first post uses the SAME base...but she only charges $9 for an 8oz bottle. Mala must be out her dayum mind!

She's a mess in a dress!

Thank you Elle for posting up this thread. At least now with the information out here people can make their own decisions on where to buy and control the ingredients they add if they want something different.

EllyEllyOxenFree · 10-07-2010, 01:08 PM

You're welcome!!! Shout out to coilynapp - not sure where she is but we were discussing this yesterday.

Nappy_curly_crown · 10-07-2010, 01:20 PM

This might not be the base she uses for the butters...but I think its DAYUM close....

afrosheenqueen · 10-07-2010, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by finehair

Quote:

Originally Posted by afrosheenqueen

Afroveda's Holy Basil, Coconut Moisture, Neem, Kissi, Nu Milk, and Emu are made from this base. You can add ingredients or herbs as you like. http://www.ingredientstodiefor.com/i...category_id=53

Her other conditioners are from the Cetyl Alcohol, Stearyl Alcohol (together these are called Cetearyl, the name she uses), Stearalkonium Chloride, Dimethyl Stearamine, Lactic Acid type of base I mentioned above.

Mala also gets NatureMulse, the emulsifier she uses for her butters, from here as well. I bought some to experiment with.

I think Mala uses a base for her butters too.
Only thing different in her butters are the oils/essential oil blend she uses.

I was wondering that too but I could never find it. I found the emulsifier she uses that I referenced above. This is another one - http://www.makingcosmetics.com/Emuls...r-MIX-p40.html

hippychic · 10-07-2010, 01:33 PM

good gawd!!! i hope she wasn't using silicones

afrosheenqueen · 10-07-2010, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by artemis

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nappy_curly_crown

Plus there is a difference between "private label agreements" and companies selling the same product manufactured in the same facility under different brands with different price points. Private label agreements are when a formulator stikes a deal with someone what a manufacturing facility to mass product a product for them. The formulator retains EXCLUSIVE rights to the formula, and the owner of the facility gets a flat manufacturing payment.

+1. Plus, a dry blend containing fatty alcohols and an emulsifier isn't a base per se. You have to add the water, oils, herbs, preservative, etc yourself making it a unique formula. Bulk liquid, cream and butter bases are pre-fabricated formulas that already contain all the water, oils, herbs, preservative, etc needed. The customer only needs to add scent to finish. Naturmulse is an emulsifier like BTMS and a million others out there which every emulsion needs, commercial or handmade. Without an emulsifier the product will separate.

Right. I think she does hand make her butters using the same emulsifiers.

Her conditioners on the other hand seem to be just bases with stuff added.

Reeky · 10-07-2010, 01:37 PM

Thank you Elle! This is exactly what I neeeeed.

Im at the point where, like you said.. "If you aint got a manufacturer I aint f*kn witcha!" im over these small companies and their drama. Id love to support my small [black] businesses but I dont feel like I get the same energy back. I cant deal with them getting a little success and losing their minds. You gotta wait weeks for your things, to sometimes receive retarded products.. then deal with bad/half ass customer service and so on and so forth. Also, my refrigerator is filling up and its not with food.. if your not preserving your stuff to where it does not mutate in normal weather im not buying it anymore. Im actually going through more money trying to use product up before it goes bad, nope!

I still have certain companies that I will patronize until they cross me lol, cause at this point good customer service gets you SO far with me. & those companies (KBN, Curl Junkie, Darcys etc.) need to give out lessons to these others on that.

Like I told Elle yesterday, im rounding out my staples.. and am going to start buying some things in bulk/large sizes. Ill still pay for what my hair likes.. but im saving where I can. Ive already got friends (& my mom lol) to split costs with me and ive got a fridge full of oils and other extras to spice this ish up myself.
Im not mad at the companies who buy bases at all, do you! hustle by any means.. I dont even care if you lie and say you mixed it yourself, but let me find the website you got it from & its a wrap..

.. as I proceed to browse a few of the above LOL, im on it!

p.s. i know somebody is maaad at this thread phaaaaaa

Nappy_curly_crown · 10-07-2010, 01:39 PM

yeah I can't find a base that similiar enough to her butters to say she uses a base...plus I think if they were bases, we wouldn't have the seperation issues and such. But since she adds that rice milk, I think that's what causes the rotten smell...she's not preserving them well enough to account for the milk.

sassywillow · 10-07-2010, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nappy_curly_crown

Quote:

Originally Posted by ellepixie

Quote:

Originally Posted by sassywillow

The Prana conditioner and the BARE conditioner are bases. I did a google on the ingredients minus the herbs and oils and I found several conditioners out there with the same exact base. What is disturbing is that Mala lists an ingredient called silica. In the other products with the same base this ingredient is listed as Dimethicone (from Silica). Does this mean that her conditoners have a cone in them and she is misleading customers???

No, silica is good for hair, it's like horsetail - a strengthener. Can you list the ingredients though for the base? She might be...

Found it. Here's the link to the conditioner base

http://www.dreamingearth.com/ingredients.html another company that uses the same base with ginger added to it.

EllyEllyOxenFree · 10-07-2010, 01:49 PM

And they can be mad...when you come with this sob story:

I began making my own skincare products because I couldn't find any that performed the way I needed and wanted them to. I was disappointed when I paid for something that promised all day moisture and didn't deliver. Aside from my own needs and of even greater concern to me was my son's skin. He has had a mild case of recurring eczema since he was a toddler. For years, he suffered with dry skin that was thirsty for gentle, long-lasting moisture. I was unable to find anything that could deliver essential moisture for both of us, so the quest to create the perfect body lotion began. I read and researched everything I could find on organic, plant based skin care.

I began experimenting with various ingredients and finally, created my own line of natural, organic skin care products, which I now present to you. My formerly dry skin has responded exceedingly well to the daily use of my exfoliating scrubs, bath milks, nourishing sea salts and body creams. I am most thrilled to announce that my son's skin is now healthy and vibrant! Our knowledgeable dermatologist advised us that the best way to treat and manage eczema is to keep the skin properly and thoroughly moisturized. His eczema is in remission and completely under control: he keeps it moisturized with "Mommy's stuff". Treating my adult acne: organic alternatives that made a difference. I met my dermatologist when I was seeking treatment for adult onset acne.

And you sell this: Phat Head Coconut Pudding with Silk Protein for $8 for 6oz

Ingredients
Organic Aloe Juice, Organic Coconut Oil, Emulsifying Wax, Palm Stearic Acid, Kosher Vegetable Glycerin, Organic Jojoba Oil, Organic Grapeseed Oil, Organic Avocado Oil, Organic Witch Hazel, Vitamin E, Phenoxyethanol, Hydrolyzed Silk, Xanthan Gum, Organic Black Willowbark Extract, Neem Oil, Rosemary Oleoresin, Citric Acid

Then we find this: EW Silk Creme 16oz for $11.15
Ingredients/Tech Specs:
Aloe barbadensis (Organic Aloe) Juice, Cocos nucifera (Organic Coconut) Oil, Emulsifying Wax NF, Palm Stearic Acid, Kosher Vegetable Glycerin, Simmondsia chinensis (Jojoba) Oil, Vitis vinifera (Grapeseed) Oil, Persea americana (Avocado) Oil, Hamamelis virginiana (Witch Hazel), Tocopherol (Vitamin E), Phenoxyethanol, Hydrolyzed Silk, Xanthan Gum (Polysaccharide Gum), Salix nigra (Organic Black Willowbark) Extract, Mannan, Azadirachta indica (Neem) Oil, Rosmarinus officinalis (Rosemary) Oleoresin, Tetrasodium EDTA, Citric Acid

Just sayin.