deva rant ...

so this was on the Devacurl FB page. and it bothered me a little; the customer felt she looked better before
not after. i thought it looked nice either way.(i'm a sucker for big red hair)

i dislike the idea that one kind of curl looks better than the other. and deva curl's comment was icing on the grump cake.
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this is the before shot
other peoples rude comments increased my grump levels: "wannabe curls" "scary"...

apparently deva curl's curl acceptance message only comes with 5lbs of devacurl hair products.

I love my hair as is without any product!(gotta have the shea butter though lol!)

*puffing out my fro'
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I totally agree. Many of kinky-curlies strive for that 3b jheri curl look. Type 2 ladies scrunch the crunch to make those waves into curls. Type 4 ladies twist and curl to make those kinks into curls. (I've done more than a few twist-n-curls in my time, but they always make me feel guilty like I'm cheating the system and might as well be relaxed.)

I noticed some comments saying that she should know better than leaving her hair in it's natural state at her age. However, I don't know if it necessarily age-appropriate to have crispy, product-laden, chola curls either.
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Well, I guess I'll be the voice of dissent. To me, there is a huge difference between natural frizz, and frizz when you are either over moisturized, or need to DC. In the first pic, her hair looked slightly dry and like the elements had done her in. I think in the end, we all should just know our hair and know how it looks when it's performing at its best. Yes, while I do not mind my poofy hair when it is over moisturized, this can also lead to breakage and weakened strands. So, I'd prefer to "fix" my hair when it is in that state.

ETA: Funnily enough, I didn't even read the description and "analyzed" her hair myself, and they basically said the same thing.
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Last edited by ellepixie; 01-28-2011 at 01:38 AM.
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Interesting thread!

I like the look of her hair in both pictures. However, in the 'after' picture her cuticles appear to be closed which will help to keep the moisture in the cortex preventing dryness (and possible breakage).

I love to wear my hair in a combed out fro, but I am aware that this is not the healthiest thing for my hair because it is a quick way for me to dry my hair out.

A lot of the comments about the 'before' picture were RUDE. I don't get why people think that they have the right to question how people choose to wear their hair because of their age. If that lady wants to wear her hair like that when she is 99 then she should do so - she's not hurting anybody!

Last edited by AlikaIssa; 01-28-2011 at 05:14 AM.
I totally agree. Many of kinky-curlies strive for that 3b jheri curl look. Type 2 ladies scrunch the crunch to make those waves into curls. Type 4 ladies twist and curl to make those kinks into curls. (I've done more than a few twist-n-curls in my time, but they always make me feel guilty like I'm cheating the system and might as well be relaxed.)

I noticed some comments saying that she should know better than leaving her hair in it's natural state at her age. However, I don't know if it necessarily age-appropriate to have crispy, product-laden, chola curls either.
Originally Posted by Shellye


Interesting thread!

I like the look of her hair in both pictures. However, in the 'after' picture her cuticles appear to be closed which will help to keep the moisture in the cortex preventing dryness (and possible breakage).

I love to wear my hair in a combed out fro, but I am aware that this is not the healthiest thing for my hair because it is a quick way for me to dry my hair out.

A lot of the comments about the 'before' picture were RUDE. I don't get why people think that they have the right to question how people choose to wear their hair because of their age. If that lady wants to wear her hair like that when she is 99 then she should do so - she's not hurting anybody!
Originally Posted by AlikaIssa
im sure wearing my hair like that when im old!
4a/b-whatever! with a twa
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the pic reminded me of miranda penn turin the photographer and "badass" is the only way to describe her hair.
No wonder she loved it before
4a/b-whatever! with a twa
hair properties: fine,porous,dense
SheaMoisture Coconut hibiscus Line
I prefer her hair in the second picture because it looked a little dry in the first one. With that said, I can see the beauty in the before pic. Some of those comments were out of hand...I wish folks were more polite.

@Shellye: Why would you feel gulity about a twist-n-curl? Wearing a stretched style on natural hair is not the same as being relaxed. It's enjoying the versatility of your hair. ehile cutting down on the amount of tangling that may occur with wearing your hair in a wash-n-go fro/puff style.

The only way I would find a twist-n-curl to be "questionable" is if a person felt the need to do them 24/7 because they took issue with their "true" hair texture.
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I'm always trying to encourage girls I know to go natural. They always say, "My hair is way too nappy to go natural and it wouldn't look like yours." I try to tell them I have high-end kinks (4b) just like they do and that all they need is a good leave-in conditioner. When I wear a twist-n-curl they love it, but I always remind them that the style is manufactured curls.

I guess I feel guilty because people know so little about black hair (including black people) and I don't want anyone to think a twist-n-curl is natural and get discouraged if they go on their own natural hair journey. I would never want someone I persuaded to go natural to be misled and have them shampoo, condition, moisturize, seal and find their hair doesn't naturally fall into a twist-n-curl.

I consider myself a Kinky Ambassador. I'll just let my raggedy twists show my true colors, rather than have Wikileaks expose my twist-n-curl.
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@Shellye: I understand where you're coming from but natural hair isn't the same thing as "unstyled"/"unmanipulated" hair. Manipulating your hair isn't less natural--it's just a way to exercise the versatility of your natural texture. You shouldn't feel bad about a certain hairstyle because of other folks lack of knowledge about natural hair. Just show them a website, YouTube channel or blog about natural hair so they can learn.
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I understand what you're saying and I also understand the woman who liked her curls before the Deva products. Hair that is unmanipulated isn't necessarily unstyled - that may be the look she was going for.

Don't get me wrong. I like styling my hair (bantu knots being my favorite style) but I don't think twist-n-curls are for me. It's not a look I'm going for.

Maybe the long, moussed curls weren't for the woman and she enjoyed her hair as is.

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Leave In - KCKT, Kiehl's Formula 133
Seal - Jojoba Oil
Moisturize - Rosewater
@Shellye: I know that hair that isn't unmanipulated isn't unstyled. I never said it was. I was just speaking to your example of a twist-n-curl. I understand a style preference over another I just wouldn't let myself feel bad for rocking a particular hairstyle due to others ignorance. With that said, to each her own.
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It's ironic that a group of ladies (on Deva's FB page) who get upset about being called horrible names about their hair would do the same about someone else.

I personally liked the second picture better. Her curls looked more moisturized and didn't overwhelm her small face and frame. Her hair looked dehydrated and tangled on top in the first photo, but I do agree that many of the Deva makeovers are too styled with way too much product. Surprisingly, this didn't seem to be the case with her hair.
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I also liked the second picture better. In the first one her hair look dry especially at the crown/canopy. The 2nd photo the hair looked moisturized and smoother. I don't think it look producty or jheri curlish. Her curls in photo 2 could have been tighter and I would think the same thin
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I like 'em both! She has beautiful color As for the frizz hate shouldn't we all be used to it by now? The fb commenter raised a good question when she asked what the others would think of kinkier hair. What about people whose hair is ALL frizz? The only way they're going to get rid of the frizz (at any age) is with a relaxer and a curling iron. I guess this natural thing is only for people of certain ages and hair textures.

And personally...my hair get's frizzier the more moisturized it is. When my lil kinks are uber "defined"? I look a crispedy, crackaly, crunchedy mess. And that's true for all the naturals I know IRL too...the hair gets "swollen" when it's full of moisture.
I totally agree. Many of kinky-curlies strive for that 3b jheri curl look. Type 2 ladies scrunch the crunch to make those waves into curls. Type 4 ladies twist and curl to make those kinks into curls. (I've done more than a few twist-n-curls in my time, but they always make me feel guilty like I'm cheating the system and might as well be relaxed.)

I noticed some comments saying that she should know better than leaving her hair in it's natural state at her age. However, I don't know if it necessarily age-appropriate to have crispy, product-laden, chola curls either.
Originally Posted by Shellye
We do, eh? Okay.

I wear my hair in braidouts/twistouts most of the time (when my hair is worn loose), because it keeps it stretched - which for MY texture is crucial. It's the difference between a tangled, knotted, breaking mess, and manageable hair.

Another thing, Type 4 hair simply looks like manipulated textured hair...not like type 3 "curls". Don't judge what's going on inside a person's head, simply by what's going on on top of it.
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Last edited by NEA; 02-07-2011 at 10:57 PM.
I totally agree. Many of kinky-curlies strive for that 3b jheri curl look. Type 2 ladies scrunch the crunch to make those waves into curls. Type 4 ladies twist and curl to make those kinks into curls. (I've done more than a few twist-n-curls in my time, but they always make me feel guilty like I'm cheating the system and might as well be relaxed.)

I noticed some comments saying that she should know better than leaving her hair in it's natural state at her age. However, I don't know if it necessarily age-appropriate to have crispy, product-laden, chola curls either.
Originally Posted by Shellye
We do, eh? Okay.

I wear my hair in braidouts/twistouts most of the time (when my hair is worn loose), because it keeps it stretched - which for MY texture is crucial. It's the difference between a tangled, knotted, breaking mess, and manageable hair.

Another thing, Type 4 hair simply looks like manipulated textured hair...not like type 3 "curls".
Originally Posted by NEA
Not to mention...I'm a type 4 and only wear wash n gos, and don't attempt to turn my hair into "something it's not" (not that a twist n curl has the intention of doing that). And my hair is way too thick and dense to ever look like a jheri curl unless I just got out of the shower.

So basically everyone's hair is different and characteristics are not simply based on curl pattern.
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I totally agree. Many of kinky-curlies strive for that 3b jheri curl look. Type 2 ladies scrunch the crunch to make those waves into curls. Type 4 ladies twist and curl to make those kinks into curls. (I've done more than a few twist-n-curls in my time, but they always make me feel guilty like I'm cheating the system and might as well be relaxed.)

I noticed some comments saying that she should know better than leaving her hair in it's natural state at her age. However, I don't know if it necessarily age-appropriate to have crispy, product-laden, chola curls either.
Originally Posted by Shellye
We do, eh? Okay.

I wear my hair in braidouts/twistouts most of the time (when my hair is worn loose), because it keeps it stretched - which for MY texture is crucial. It's the difference between a tangled, knotted, breaking mess, and manageable hair.

Another thing, Type 4 hair simply looks like manipulated textured hair...not like type 3 "curls". Don't judge what's going on inside a person's head, simply by what's going on on top of it.
Originally Posted by NEA
Kanye shrugged. Some do wear twist outs and such to make their hair look less kinky and more curly. You've never stumbled across those types on the hair blogosphere? If not, count yourself blessed. I've run across enough for Shellye's not to cause me to bat an eye. Also, I read the sentence you highlighted (and the preceding one) as more of a general thing than a blanket statement.

Manipulated type 4 hair rarely looks like type 3 hair. You're right. But you'd have to fight some folks if you said that to their "good hair" having faces.
I totally agree. Many of kinky-curlies strive for that 3b jheri curl look. Type 2 ladies scrunch the crunch to make those waves into curls. Type 4 ladies twist and curl to make those kinks into curls. (I've done more than a few twist-n-curls in my time, but they always make me feel guilty like I'm cheating the system and might as well be relaxed.)

I noticed some comments saying that she should know better than leaving her hair in it's natural state at her age. However, I don't know if it necessarily age-appropriate to have crispy, product-laden, chola curls either.
Originally Posted by Shellye
We do, eh? Okay.

I wear my hair in braidouts/twistouts most of the time (when my hair is worn loose), because it keeps it stretched - which for MY texture is crucial. It's the difference between a tangled, knotted, breaking mess, and manageable hair.

Another thing, Type 4 hair simply looks like manipulated textured hair...not like type 3 "curls". Don't judge what's going on inside a person's head, simply by what's going on on top of it.
Originally Posted by NEA
Kanye shrugged. Some do wear twist outs and such to make their hair look less kinky and more curly. You've never stumbled across those types on the hair blogosphere? If not, count yourself blessed. I've run across enough for Shellye's not to cause me to bat an eye. Also, I read the sentence you highlighted (and the preceding one) as more of a general thing than a blanket statement.

Manipulated type 4 hair rarely looks like type 3 hair. You're right. But you'd have to fight some folks if you said that to their "good hair" having faces.
Originally Posted by AmberBrown
...and some don't. So, how do you determine, by looking at person's head, which person they happen to be? Is there some test? No, there isn't. So, it's best to say, "Some type 4 women..."
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We do, eh? Okay.

I wear my hair in braidouts/twistouts most of the time (when my hair is worn loose), because it keeps it stretched - which for MY texture is crucial. It's the difference between a tangled, knotted, breaking mess, and manageable hair.

Another thing, Type 4 hair simply looks like manipulated textured hair...not like type 3 "curls". Don't judge what's going on inside a person's head, simply by what's going on on top of it.
Originally Posted by NEA
Kanye shrugged. Some do wear twist outs and such to make their hair look less kinky and more curly. You've never stumbled across those types on the hair blogosphere? If not, count yourself blessed. I've run across enough for Shellye's not to cause me to bat an eye. Also, I read the sentence you highlighted (and the preceding one) as more of a general thing than a blanket statement.

Manipulated type 4 hair rarely looks like type 3 hair. You're right. But you'd have to fight some folks if you said that to their "good hair" having faces.
Originally Posted by AmberBrown
...and some don't. So, how do you determine, by looking at person's head, which person they happen to be? Is there some test? No, there isn't. So, it's best to say, "Some type 4 women..."
Originally Posted by NEA
The bolded is implicit in my original "some". If some do, of course some don't. I have no problem acknowledging the existence of either group... As for how I, personally, make the determination--like I said, I find this ignance on the blogosphere. That is, online where most communication is written. If a chick is saying: I hate the way this nappy isht on the top of my hair looks when it's not curly and defined...it looks like a slave...I wish I had good hurr like *insert type 3 "guru" here*...I think it's safe to say they pass your test.

Last edited by AmberBrown; 02-08-2011 at 12:28 AM.

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