Please help.. Desperately seeking agave nectar extract

KindaWavy · 11-10-2008, 10:51 PM

I've still been fiddling with homemade natural products. I've noticed that a few items I really like contain Agave Nectar Extract, so I've been looking for this online. All I've been able to locate thus far is the Agave Nectar, usually being sold as a low-glycemic sugar substitute or as an ingredient in other supplements. I'd like to purchase the already prepared extract, ideally. If I can't locate that, finding it in dried plant/herbal form would be great, too. I can make an extract from herbs, but don't know how to get a consistent solution when beginning with a liquid (nectar or juice).

I've noticed that sometimes Agave is referred to as either American Aloe or False Aloe in the course of my searches. Does anyone have any rec's on where to find the extract, plant/herb, OR advise on how to perform the extraction from the nectar? I'd be so grateful to anyone who could point me in the right direction!!

/begging

Patycurls · 11-15-2008, 05:00 PM

If there's a Trader Joe's or Whole Foods near you, you'll probably find it there. I've seen it Trader Joe's in Boston.

afrosheenqueen · 11-16-2008, 04:41 PM

I was researching this awhile ago so I think I can help.

I think the Agave Nectar that you see being advertised is the agave extract. Its a sweeter version of honey. One of the things that makes Ohm's Sweet Hair Pudding different from KCCC is that SHP uses honey and KCCC uses agave.

You can read more about the process from Wiki http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agave_syrup

ETA: I would also write to Kinky Curly or other companies that use it and ask where they pourchase it from.

breezybaby · 11-16-2008, 05:41 PM

http://morebeer.com/view_product/813...Extract_2.5_lb

Tatiannaluv · 11-17-2008, 03:17 PM

I highly doubt Kinky Curly would provide anyone with the information on where to purchase one of the ACTIVE ingredients in their most successful products...and rightfully so. I wouldn't be surprised if you didn't get a response at all, and if you did the business owner is naive. I wouldn't tell someone where I got my ingredients either if I were trying to sell a product. It defeats the purpose completely.

I think that you should just come up with your own hair products. I used to be a soap maker so I am sorta in the natural product "fold" and know all too well that companies that are "home grown" are irritated and intentionally complicate ingredient lists because of those who attempt to duplicate their ingredients and then post them on forums (or make them themselves). This is precisely why it is so difficult for companies to relase their TRUE ingredient lists 100%....they are afraid of the "product-bootleggers".

ewenique · 11-17-2008, 06:44 PM

Agave nectar comes from agave plants, which are similar to aloe vera plants, but much larger. They grow naturally out west and in Mexico. Like aloe vera, the natural form is a liquidy gel-like substance, unlike many herbs which are flower type plants that can be dried and crushed.

I use agave nectar instead of sugar in coffee and tea. It's runnier than honey and doesn't have such a distinct taste, plus it doesn't effect the blood sugar level as dramatically as sugar.

I've been thinking of combining agave nectar with FOTE to see if it would work similarly to KCCC. Is this your plan, Kindawavy?

curlygirlyme · 11-25-2008, 06:45 AM

http://www.wholeandnatural.com/servl...ic-Blue/Detail

KindaWavy · 11-25-2008, 10:52 AM

Thanks so much for all the great info! You guys are awesome!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by ewenique

I've been thinking of combining agave nectar with FOTE to see if it would work similarly to KCCC. Is this your plan, Kindawavy?

Kind of. I've been messing with several different herbal ingredients (horsetail, marshmallow root, nettle, hops, etc), infusing them, and adding to flaxseed gel and hair butters/creams. I hadn't been using FOTE, mostly because I didn't have luck with it in my hair when I tried it at first. I usually use LOTD when I want aloe, but will probably dig out the FOTE and give it a try since my hair has been sooo different since the temps and dew points have dropped.

It would be great to end up with something similar to KCCC- that stuff is just Awesomeness in a jar, but I'm not holding my breath on being that successful! LOL

Curlygoddess · 11-29-2008, 10:02 PM

I really think the agave nectar is the secret to the Curling Custard.

She just did another in store event and you can tell she is really into all the organic chemistry of herbs and plant based extracts and stuff. I didnt know that her father was one of the guys that started Pro-Line? you know ...Hair Food, Perm Repair.

so she may have access to things that we cant find on the internet.

has anyone tried to contact her and ask where to get it? now I'm really curious!

redcelticcurls · 11-30-2008, 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tatiannaluv

I highly doubt Kinky Curly would provide anyone with the information on where to purchase one of the ACTIVE ingredients in their most successful products...and rightfully so. I wouldn't be surprised if you didn't get a response at all, and if you did the business owner is naive. I wouldn't tell someone where I got my ingredients either if I were trying to sell a product. It defeats the purpose completely.

I think that you should just come up with your own hair products. I used to be a soap maker so I am sorta in the natural product "fold" and know all too well that companies that are "home grown" are irritated and intentionally complicate ingredient lists because of those who attempt to duplicate their ingredients and then post them on forums (or make them themselves). This is precisely why it is so difficult for companies to relase their TRUE ingredient lists 100%....they are afraid of the "product-bootleggers".

I agree. I wouldn't give out the info. If a product owner/maker is making of living of off a line, why give away how to make it? it's just losing income.

Curlygoddess · 11-30-2008, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redcelticcurls

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tatiannaluv

I highly doubt Kinky Curly would provide anyone with the information on where to purchase one of the ACTIVE ingredients in their most successful products...and rightfully so. I wouldn't be surprised if you didn't get a response at all, and if you did the business owner is naive. I wouldn't tell someone where I got my ingredients either if I were trying to sell a product. It defeats the purpose completely.

I think that you should just come up with your own hair products. I used to be a soap maker so I am sorta in the natural product "fold" and know all too well that companies that are "home grown" are irritated and intentionally complicate ingredient lists because of those who attempt to duplicate their ingredients and then post them on forums (or make them themselves). This is precisely why it is so difficult for companies to relase their TRUE ingredient lists 100%....they are afraid of the "product-bootleggers".

I agree. I wouldn't give out the info. If a product owner/maker is making of living of off a line, why give away how to make it? it's just losing income.

she may or may not tell but arent WE ALL trying to make our own?
aren't we are all being product-bootleggers when we try to make Jessicurl flax seed gel and KCCC so its worth a shot.

I just called KBB and they told me that they get their agave from a health food store.

afrosheenqueen · 11-30-2008, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tatiannaluv

I highly doubt Kinky Curly would provide anyone with the information on where to purchase one of the ACTIVE ingredients in their most successful products...and rightfully so. I wouldn't be surprised if you didn't get a response at all, and if you did the business owner is naive. I wouldn't tell someone where I got my ingredients either if I were trying to sell a product. It defeats the purpose completely.

I think that you should just come up with your own hair products. I used to be a soap maker so I am sorta in the natural product "fold" and know all too well that companies that are "home grown" are irritated and intentionally complicate ingredient lists because of those who attempt to duplicate their ingredients and then post them on forums (or make them themselves). This is precisely why it is so difficult for companies to relase their TRUE ingredient lists 100%....they are afraid of the "product-bootleggers".

Eh. Nothing ventured is nothing gained. Its an ingredient found in one of her products. I don't think it hurts to ask where she gets her supply from even if she doesn't get a reply. She's not asking instructions on how to make KCCC herself. That would guarantee a "no answer" email.

It looks like from the links above there are plenty of places to get it from or at least a start anyway.

Koukla72 · 11-30-2008, 02:39 PM

Edited due to a cyberstalker. Sorry, guys.

Curlygoddess · 12-03-2008, 06:45 PM

well I emailed them and asked if they could tell me where they get it from and here is what the owner replied back and said

From: Kinky-Curly <info@kinky-curly.com>
Subject: RE: help needed
To: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
Date: Monday, December 1, 2008, 12:03 PM

Thank you for your email and for the kind words about Kinky-Curly.

WOW! I have received quite a few emails this week asking a variety of questions regarding the ingredients of my products. Where do I purchase them, how are they extracted, measurements, etc.

Just as I explained in my other emails, I work closely with a chemist when I develop my products. The products are made at a lab and they purchase all of the ingredients.

I encourage ALL women to start their own businesses. I applaud you for wanting to make a curly hair product but I ask that you please don’t step on my toes and what I have developed. I like to play fair and do not support copying anyone’s formula or product idea. It is unethical and basically stealing and I have never done it.

I believe that the most successful companies are the ones with unique and innovative product ideas:
Jonathan Torch with Curl Keeper, Chaz Dean and his Cleansing Conditioners, Jessicurl and her all natural Rockin Ringlets, Miss Jessie’s and their curl creams for ethnic hair.

I strongly support us starting original business and especially hair related ones. I would be more than happy to give you advice and lead you in the right direction.

Warm regards,
Shelley Davis

So her lab buys her ingredients for her when they make the product.
For some reason I thought that this was something she made at home?

Oh well, can't say that I didnt try....

afrosheenqueen · 12-05-2008, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curlygoddess

So her lab buys her ingredients for her when they make the product.
For some reason I thought that this was something she made at home?

Oh well, can't say that I didnt try....

Me too. At least now we know.

Koukla72 said:

Quote:

Seriously - if you want the exact product, just buy it from them. You will be saving yourself money as well as hassle, because you will have to go through a lot of the same things and a lot of the same expenses to figure it out in the end. Possibly more since you (we) are starting from a place of greater ignorance and will likely hit more dead ends that could have otherwise been avoided. If you're trying to make you own unique product because none of these are as perfect for your hair as what you could make - well then, happy trails and welcome to the poverty-inducing madness.

I agree.

Tatiannaluv · 02-27-2009, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curlygoddess

Quote:

Originally Posted by redcelticcurls

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tatiannaluv

I highly doubt Kinky Curly would provide anyone with the information on where to purchase one of the ACTIVE ingredients in their most successful products...and rightfully so. I wouldn't be surprised if you didn't get a response at all, and if you did the business owner is naive. I wouldn't tell someone where I got my ingredients either if I were trying to sell a product. It defeats the purpose completely.

I think that you should just come up with your own hair products. I used to be a soap maker so I am sorta in the natural product "fold" and know all too well that companies that are "home grown" are irritated and intentionally complicate ingredient lists because of those who attempt to duplicate their ingredients and then post them on forums (or make them themselves). This is precisely why it is so difficult for companies to relase their TRUE ingredient lists 100%....they are afraid of the "product-bootleggers".

I agree. I wouldn't give out the info. If a product owner/maker is making of living of off a line, why give away how to make it? it's just losing income.

she may or may not tell but arent WE ALL trying to make our own?
aren't we are all being product-bootleggers when we try to make Jessicurl flax seed gel and KCCC so its worth a shot.

I just called KBB and they told me that they get their agave from a health food store.

When we create products for ourselves, simply recipes that we have found work for us than of course that's fine, and yes..everyone does it. But those who scan ingredient lists of natural home-grown businesses with the intention of replicating the product are of a different class, and no not all of us do it, and yes as Ms. Davis stated it IS incredibly unethical, no matter how commonplace it seems to be in the curly/natural community. Several years ago there werent many product lines catering to my curls (especially ones that are all natural) now that they are, I don't have any intention of ripping them down. If I want a product bad enough, I'll buy it.

Tatiannaluv · 02-27-2009, 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by afrosheenqueen

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tatiannaluv

I highly doubt Kinky Curly would provide anyone with the information on where to purchase one of the ACTIVE ingredients in their most successful products...and rightfully so. I wouldn't be surprised if you didn't get a response at all, and if you did the business owner is naive. I wouldn't tell someone where I got my ingredients either if I were trying to sell a product. It defeats the purpose completely.

I think that you should just come up with your own hair products. I used to be a soap maker so I am sorta in the natural product "fold" and know all too well that companies that are "home grown" are irritated and intentionally complicate ingredient lists because of those who attempt to duplicate their ingredients and then post them on forums (or make them themselves). This is precisely why it is so difficult for companies to relase their TRUE ingredient lists 100%....they are afraid of the "product-bootleggers".

Eh. Nothing ventured is nothing gained. Its an ingredient found in one of her products. I don't think it hurts to ask where she gets her supply from even if she doesn't get a reply. She's not asking instructions on how to make KCCC herself. That would guarantee a "no answer" email.

It looks like from the links above there are plenty of places to get it from or at least a start anyway.

Judging by the response posted here, I highly doubt the owner of KCCC is stupid...anyone who asks "Gee, where do you get your ingredients from" clearly has intentions that wouldn't behoove her business. I think her response was courteous, clearly a "stop trying to jock my ish" email...but courteous nonetheless. I can't say I would be that nice if someone asked me such a question. Just the audacity.

Anyway, to the OP, if you are still interested in making KCCC, I strongly advise you to take a look at nappturality. The women on their thought they had the formulation to a T (percentages and all) and failed miserably. They spent more money trying to make KCCC than they would if they just purchased the product.

Curly forums sure can rip a business

...this is the tenth "How can I duplicate *insert product line here*" post I have seen just today. These forums pop up right up under the product line, because google ranks it so high. I feel sorry for them, Lord knows that until they reach Carol's Daughter status they probably aren't making as much money as we suspect and investing more than they are getting out.

I don't know the justification for intentionally duplicating this woman's products is similar to the excuse a lot of people use when they download music illegally. If it ain't yours quit tryna steal it.

Suburbanbushbabe · 02-27-2009, 08:55 PM

Quote:

So her lab buys her ingredients for her when they make the product.
For some reason I thought that this was something she made at home?

I think that was an extremely courteous response on her part, considering you asked her to share her corporate secrets. Pretty cheeky.