Soap bar users: Is there a way to close the cuticle besides an ACV rinse?

My mom's friend gave me some soap bars she made to try. I want to use them, but I hate the smell of ACV and I think it slightly irritates my scalp. Is there something else that will do the same job?
~ Dense, fine, low porosity ~
Some people use a citric acid rinse. Just dilute some in water and rinse similarly to an acv rinse.

Kerri

2?/3a ??? ; fine; high density; normal porosity and elasticity
color treated

CURRENTLY USING:
cleanse:Organix Vanilla Silk, Use Me Cleansing Cream
rinse out/li:Ion Effective Care, Tresseme Naturals Radiant Volume (both with NPF added)
stylers:Curl Keeper, UFD Curly Magic, & Alba Botanicals Strong Hold Gel
PT:CJ Repair Me

mod CG since August 2010
Are you sure you're not using too much ACV? I wanna cry too if it gets in my eyes or anywhere other than my hair. It can really sting. I keep a solution of vinegar and water in a spray bottle in my shower and spritz it on that way. You really don't need to use much at all - just 1/2 tablespoon to a cup of water for long hair - and if the smell bothers you, you can rinse it off. I use white vinegar, BTW. It's just what I have on hand all the time.
3a/medium texture/normal porosity
My mom's friend gave me some soap bars she made to try. I want to use them, but I hate the smell of ACV and I think it slightly irritates my scalp. Is there something else that will do the same job?
Originally Posted by DaiseeDay
Excellent question - I've been wondering myself. I'm interested in trying soap bars, but the ACV rinse kind of turns me off, although not for the same reasons. Honestly, it just seems like a hassle and I'm lazy!

hmkenny could be right, and you could try a weaker solution. It might help with the odor issue, too. I also use white vinegar (always have it around), and I find the smell to be slightly less obnoxious. However, having very sensitive skin myself, I know that if you're sensitive, you just are. And if the smell is a deal-breaker, I can relate.

curlyserf, do you know the dilution ratio for a citric acid rinse? Just curious.

Just had a brainstorm: we should ask kathymack if there are other options - she knows everything! Calling kathymack, calling kathymack....
3b/3a, medium porosity, slightly coarse, high elasticity, high density. CG 2004; mod CG since 2006. CG again since 4/1/11.

Lowpoo:
Gudonya Salty Dawg (etsy), SM Moisture Retention
CO: Gudonya Intense (etsy), SM Restorative, Tresemme Naturals
LI: Gudonya IHC, SMCH Milk, Tresemme Nat, Biotera LI
Stylers (current rotation): AVG/H20 spray, Eco Styler, EVCO, SMCH smoothie and mist, La Bella LoC, ORS Lock & Twist.
Homemade DTs, PTs and Pre-Poos
Love flour sack towels.
Coconut oil = magic!
My mom's friend gave me some soap bars she made to try. I want to use them, but I hate the smell of ACV and I think it slightly irritates my scalp. Is there something else that will do the same job?
Originally Posted by DaiseeDay
Excellent question - I've been wondering myself. I'm interested in trying soap bars, but the ACV rinse kind of turns me off, although not for the same reasons. Honestly, it just seems like a hassle and I'm lazy!

hmkenny could be right, and you could try a weaker solution. It might help with the odor issue, too. I also use white vinegar (always have it around), and I find the smell to be slightly less obnoxious. However, having very sensitive skin myself, I know that if you're sensitive, you just are. And if the smell is a deal-breaker, I can relate.

curlyserf, do you know the dilution ratio for a citric acid rinse? Just curious.

Just had a brainstorm: we should ask kathymack if there are other options - she knows everything! Calling kathymack, calling kathymack....
Originally Posted by bluesheep
Kathy sells her own soap bars and uses them as her only cleanser, so she would definitely be the one to answer questions about them.

I found a thread that referenced a mixture of 1/4 t. citric acid in 1 cup of water. After a few times of doing it, I can basically eyeball it, so I don't measure any more.

Kerri

2?/3a ??? ; fine; high density; normal porosity and elasticity
color treated

CURRENTLY USING:
cleanse:Organix Vanilla Silk, Use Me Cleansing Cream
rinse out/li:Ion Effective Care, Tresseme Naturals Radiant Volume (both with NPF added)
stylers:Curl Keeper, UFD Curly Magic, & Alba Botanicals Strong Hold Gel
PT:CJ Repair Me

mod CG since August 2010
Are you sure you're not using too much ACV? I wanna cry too if it gets in my eyes or anywhere other than my hair. It can really sting. I keep a solution of vinegar and water in a spray bottle in my shower and spritz it on that way. You really don't need to use much at all - just 1/2 tablespoon to a cup of water for long hair - and if the smell bothers you, you can rinse it off. I use white vinegar, BTW. It's just what I have on hand all the time.
Originally Posted by hmkenny
I've been using about a whole tablespoon for 1 cup, so yepp it could be too much. I just notice a slight burning on my scalp after a while and then it starts itching. I thought about just rinsing it out, but I wasn't sure if it would be as effective.

My mom's friend gave me some soap bars she made to try. I want to use them, but I hate the smell of ACV and I think it slightly irritates my scalp. Is there something else that will do the same job?
Originally Posted by DaiseeDay
Excellent question - I've been wondering myself. I'm interested in trying soap bars, but the ACV rinse kind of turns me off, although not for the same reasons. Honestly, it just seems like a hassle and I'm lazy!

hmkenny could be right, and you could try a weaker solution. It might help with the odor issue, too. I also use white vinegar (always have it around), and I find the smell to be slightly less obnoxious. However, having very sensitive skin myself, I know that if you're sensitive, you just are. And if the smell is a deal-breaker, I can relate.

curlyserf, do you know the dilution ratio for a citric acid rinse? Just curious.

Just had a brainstorm: we should ask kathymack if there are other options - she knows everything! Calling kathymack, calling kathymack....
Originally Posted by bluesheep
Laziness is part of why I don't really like the ACV rinse too lol.

It would be really cool if there were a conditioner that did the same job.

I wonder if it will work if I just mix some into my regular condishioner.

Off to experiment....
~ Dense, fine, low porosity ~

Last edited by DaiseeDay; 05-03-2011 at 03:24 PM.
I haven't used citric acid in a while, but I think curlyserf got it right 1/4 t to 1 c water.

Forgot to add, that those are the only citric rinses that I know. I often wonder if it's necessary, if your products have a pH of 4.5?? They go on your hair and should restore pH shouldn't they??
3a (Corkicelli), highlighted, fine, low porosity
modified CG, since April '07
CG since 3/11/08

SE PA

HGs: Anything Sevi; Curly Kinks Satin Roots, Curlycue ReNew and Coil Jam; homemade FSG and okra gel; soap bars; UFD Curly Magic; Botanical Spirits Jellies, CJ Repair Me, Marie Dean Leave Ins and Curl Creams
I haven't used citric acid in a while, but I think curlyserf got it right 1/4 t to 1 c water.

Forgot to add, that those are the only citric rinses that I know. I often wonder if it's necessary, if your products have a pH of 4.5?? They go on your hair and should restore pH shouldn't they??
Originally Posted by kathymack
So, you don't think an ACV or citric acid rinse is necessary?

I think I'm just going to try to find a conditioner with citric acid listed as an ingredient and see how it works.
~ Dense, fine, low porosity ~

Last edited by DaiseeDay; 05-03-2011 at 03:33 PM.
I haven't used citric acid in a while, but I think curlyserf got it right 1/4 t to 1 c water.

Forgot to add, that those are the only citric rinses that I know. I often wonder if it's necessary, if your products have a pH of 4.5?? They go on your hair and should restore pH shouldn't they??
Originally Posted by kathymack
So, you don't think an ACV or citric acid rinse is necessary?

I think I'm just going to try to find a conditioner with citric acid listed as an ingredient and see how it works.
Originally Posted by DaiseeDay
I do an ACV rinse, so I'm not saying that it isn't necessary. I'm just wondering if you use products (rinse out, etc.) that have the correct pH--maybe it isn't. It's something about which I've given thought, so I voiced it. Thought it might make an interesting discussion. Anyone else have insight on this??
3a (Corkicelli), highlighted, fine, low porosity
modified CG, since April '07
CG since 3/11/08

SE PA

HGs: Anything Sevi; Curly Kinks Satin Roots, Curlycue ReNew and Coil Jam; homemade FSG and okra gel; soap bars; UFD Curly Magic; Botanical Spirits Jellies, CJ Repair Me, Marie Dean Leave Ins and Curl Creams
I haven't used citric acid in a while, but I think curlyserf got it right 1/4 t to 1 c water.

Forgot to add, that those are the only citric rinses that I know. I often wonder if it's necessary, if your products have a pH of 4.5?? They go on your hair and should restore pH shouldn't they??
Originally Posted by kathymack
I've been using Dr. Bronner's Liquid Castile Soap lately, and I heard that you had to use an acidic rinse after that, too. I don't think all soap bars are made with Castile Soap, but I've tried skipping my vinegar rinse after I wash my hair, and nothing has happened. It's no frizzier than it normally is! Since I've been ditching my ACV rinse lately (not so much because I'm lazy, but because I always get into the shower and forget to measure it all out beforehand! ), and nothing happened, I've come to the conclusion that it's not necessary. Maybe Kathy is onto something with the products and their pH's restoring the proper balance (although I'm no scientist!).
Type 2c/3a with lots of hair and a super sensitive scalp! Med/slightly coarse texture, low porosity and elasticity.

Favorite...
Low poo: Organix TTM, Essential Wholesale Free & Clean
RO/LI: TN, GFTN, YTC
Stylers: EcoStylers, GF Curl Shaping Gel, Aussie Aussome Volume Mousse & Instant Freeze Gel, GFPC, LALNC, La Bella Lots of Curls, Apricot Oil, KMFUM, AO B5DG
Extras: sugar scrubs, AVG washes, pre-poos with EVCO, oiling scalp before washes, plopping, gelatin PT.
Mod-CG since 12/1/10!
Castile soap is made through the same saponification process as the natural soap bars the rest of us use. I just looked up the ingredients for the Dr. Bronner's Peppermint: Water, Organic Coconut Oil*, Potassium Hydroxide**, Organic Olive Oil*, Mentha Arvensis*, Organic Hemp Oil, Organic Jojoba Oil, Organic Peppermint Oil*, Citric Acid, Tocopherol

I'm assuming Potassium Hydroxide (potash) serves the same purpose as sodium hydroxide (lye.)
3a (Corkicelli), highlighted, fine, low porosity
modified CG, since April '07
CG since 3/11/08

SE PA

HGs: Anything Sevi; Curly Kinks Satin Roots, Curlycue ReNew and Coil Jam; homemade FSG and okra gel; soap bars; UFD Curly Magic; Botanical Spirits Jellies, CJ Repair Me, Marie Dean Leave Ins and Curl Creams
Daisee, I always rinse out the ACV. I pour it over my hair, squish it around a little, wait a minute and rinse it out. It seems to work all right.

Thanks for the info on Dr. Bronner's wavynwild - another thing I've been considering trying.


Sent from my iPhone using CurlTalk
3b/3a, medium porosity, slightly coarse, high elasticity, high density. CG 2004; mod CG since 2006. CG again since 4/1/11.

Lowpoo:
Gudonya Salty Dawg (etsy), SM Moisture Retention
CO: Gudonya Intense (etsy), SM Restorative, Tresemme Naturals
LI: Gudonya IHC, SMCH Milk, Tresemme Nat, Biotera LI
Stylers (current rotation): AVG/H20 spray, Eco Styler, EVCO, SMCH smoothie and mist, La Bella LoC, ORS Lock & Twist.
Homemade DTs, PTs and Pre-Poos
Love flour sack towels.
Coconut oil = magic!
I haven't used citric acid in a while, but I think curlyserf got it right 1/4 t to 1 c water.

Forgot to add, that those are the only citric rinses that I know. I often wonder if it's necessary, if your products have a pH of 4.5?? They go on your hair and should restore pH shouldn't they??
Originally Posted by kathymack
So, you don't think an ACV or citric acid rinse is necessary?

I think I'm just going to try to find a conditioner with citric acid listed as an ingredient and see how it works.
Originally Posted by DaiseeDay
I do an ACV rinse, so I'm not saying that it isn't necessary. I'm just wondering if you use products (rinse out, etc.) that have the correct pH--maybe it isn't. It's something about which I've given thought, so I voiced it. Thought it might make an interesting discussion. Anyone else have insight on this??
Originally Posted by kathymack
Right. I was going to put that to the test. Maybe my post was worded wrong. I was voicing what I believe: which is that an acv rinse probably isn't necessary with the right ph product - especially one containing citric acid. I've used a soap bar, so I know that something is needed to close the cuticle - my logic is that it isn't necessarily a stinky acv rinse. It seemed like you were thinking along the same lines... I'll just see for myself.
~ Dense, fine, low porosity ~
you don't need to do an acv rinse after using soap as long as you use a conditioner after washing. All conditioners (should be) formulated to have a pH of 4.5-5.5 (sometimes as low as 4.0). If you are using a conditioner after washing with soap you should have no problems

you can also use anything that is acidic. hibiscus tea, citric acid, amla rinse etc.
2 issues at play here. If you have hard water, you're likely to feel "soap scum" on your hair without the acidic rinse or something to get the mineral/soap residue off your hair. Citric acid in a product might do the trick if there is enough in there (and if the pH is 4.5 to 5, there must be a fair bit).
Vinegar does smell vinegary and can be itchy, especially if you've got a sensitive scalp or "mold" allergies.
I don't know if soap bars in soft water present any problem with residue.

As far as un-swelling the hair shaft after exposure to the high pH of the soap bar (and getting the cuticle to return to its normal position), your low-pH products are going to help with that so why bother with an extra step?
http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.com/
Thanks coilynapp and IAgirl for "articulating" my theory. I've been doing the ACV rinse, but wondering if it's really needed if I used the right products following the soap bar. Now I know it isn't necessary.
3a (Corkicelli), highlighted, fine, low porosity
modified CG, since April '07
CG since 3/11/08

SE PA

HGs: Anything Sevi; Curly Kinks Satin Roots, Curlycue ReNew and Coil Jam; homemade FSG and okra gel; soap bars; UFD Curly Magic; Botanical Spirits Jellies, CJ Repair Me, Marie Dean Leave Ins and Curl Creams

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