My hair is insane - super sensitive, knotty, help!

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Okay, going to read through these - can someone help me decipher these ingredients: - something in here could be messing with my hair? Roughing up the cuticle maybe?

Water, Laureth 23, Polyquaternium 4, Coral Flower (Russelia Equisetiformis) Extract, Prunus Persica Nectarina Fruit Extract, Fragrance, Propylene Glycol, Hydroxyethylcellulose, Benzyl Alcohol, Acrylates/Beheneth 25 Methacrylate Copolymer, Aminomethyl Propanol, DMDM Hydantoin, Acrylates Copolymer, Disodium EDTA
3b/fine/normal porosity/normal elasticity

LOVES behentrimonium methosulfate
(don't ask me to pronounce that!)


Want to grow it long again!
And simply want to figure out this hair of mine!
Okay, going to read through these - can someone help me decipher these ingredients: - something in here could be messing with my hair? Roughing up the cuticle maybe?

Water, Laureth 23, Polyquaternium 4, Coral Flower (Russelia Equisetiformis) Extract, Prunus Persica Nectarina Fruit Extract, Fragrance, Propylene Glycol, Hydroxyethylcellulose, Benzyl Alcohol, Acrylates/Beheneth 25 Methacrylate Copolymer, Aminomethyl Propanol, DMDM Hydantoin, Acrylates Copolymer, Disodium EDTA
Originally Posted by LilaGirl
Many people cannot handle polyquats. And some people's hair is sensitive to herbs/florals. However, I think you're best to wait and see what Corrina has to say
Finer, mixed with coarser strands, low-porosity, wavy curly whirly hair...3A, 2C hair. Medium thickness, medium elasticity.
S-shaped hair with corkscrew ends. My hair is even more confused than me ;p
My hair officially hates protein Once a month is enough!
Currently a fan of TiGi products, (rock on, TiGi Curlesque styling creme!) but that will soon change - I am a self-avowed product junkie! Yay!
BIG fan of supersoaker method - thanks Rudeechick!
Okay, going to read through these - can someone help me decipher these ingredients: - something in here could be messing with my hair? Roughing up the cuticle maybe?



Water, Laureth 23, Polyquaternium 4, Coral Flower (Russelia Equisetiformis) Extract, Prunus Persica Nectarina Fruit Extract, Fragrance, Propylene Glycol, Hydroxyethylcellulose, Benzyl Alcohol, Acrylates/Beheneth 25 Methacrylate Copolymer, Aminomethyl Propanol, DMDM Hydantoin, Acrylates Copolymer, Disodium EDTA
Originally Posted by LilaGirl


Many people cannot handle polyquats. And some people's hair is sensitive to herbs/florals. However, I think you're best to wait and see what Corrina has to say
Originally Posted by Knotty_Maddy

Hmm, Maddy is right that some people do have issues with certain polyquats (polyquats 4 and 10 tend to be the most problematic). I've read that they feel something like a buildup type of feeling to their hair. I also noticed propylene glycol, which is another humectant like glycerin (it's farther down in the ingredient list, so I would be less likely to think this is the problem ingredient for you, but I can't say absolutely). It's sometimes difficult for me to identify problem ingredients (aside from the really obvious) because I've never had to sleuth them out for my own hair. You might want to spend some time searching the Curl Chemist articles- that's where I've found the majority of my info, and she might go into more detail and offer some additional insight.

Sent from my BlackBerry 9800 using Tapatalk
Knotty_Maddy likes this.

3a/f/iii
Modified CG since 11/5/11
CLEANSE: VO5 Vanilla Mint Tea Clarifying, DevaCare No-Poo, CHS Treatment Shampoo
RO: DevaCare One Condition, SS Caitlin's Conditioner, Mop Top Daily Conditioner
LI: SS Repairing Protein Treatment, CHS Silk Leave-In
STYLE: Re:Coil, Curl Keeper, Deva Ultra Defining Gel, Curls Rock Amplifier and Strong Hold Mousse, Sweet Curls Elixirs Okra Gel and Hard Hold Gel, SS Curl Enhancing Jelly and Firm Hold Gel
Yeah, someone here said when they are trying something they use it for a week - but what if you can't stand it anymore? Like the first day I did the KCKT/HEBE combo I LOVED MY HAIR BEYOND BELIEF.

Next day - not so much.

Dry and what felt like tons of breakage? Or SSK or IDK what!

Did day three - some nice hold no frizz, more frizz later in the evening, now back to feeling breakage/dry/crunchy.



So do I switch to something tomorrow? I'm actually out of stuff to dry - going to order pattern pusha -
3b/fine/normal porosity/normal elasticity

LOVES behentrimonium methosulfate
(don't ask me to pronounce that!)


Want to grow it long again!
And simply want to figure out this hair of mine!
Yeah, I seriously had to just wash that out of my hair b/c I think it was damaging it! Woah.

So I left in My Honey Child Olive you deep condish - and that's it b/c every product I have now is going out the window! So I just put that in.

Oddly, though it says protein-free, but the ingredients seem Protein rich to me! We'll see - if anything it should be a nice little "treatment"

Water, Olea Europea (Olive) Fruit Oil,Honey, Olea Europea (Olive) Leaf Extract, Soya Milk (Glycine soja), Fresh Cantaloupe Melon (Cucumis Cantalupensis), Natural Yoghurt, , Olive Oil (Olea europaea), Avocado Oil (Persea gratissima), Seaweed , Jojoba Oil (Simmondsia chinensis), Violet Leaf Absolute (Viola odorata), Orange Blossom Absolute (Citrus dulcis), Neroli Oil (Citrus amara),

Ingredient Attributes: silicone free, sulfate free, paraben free, protein free, glycerin free
3b/fine/normal porosity/normal elasticity

LOVES behentrimonium methosulfate
(don't ask me to pronounce that!)


Want to grow it long again!
And simply want to figure out this hair of mine!
Oh, and I just want to post this here: http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...e&articleid=79

Wondering about that Goldwell "deposit only" color too.
3b/fine/normal porosity/normal elasticity

LOVES behentrimonium methosulfate
(don't ask me to pronounce that!)


Want to grow it long again!
And simply want to figure out this hair of mine!
Oh, and I just want to post this here: http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...e&articleid=79

Wondering about that Goldwell "deposit only" color too.
Originally Posted by LilaGirl
The link you posted doesn't work --at least for me.
2C/3A, fine, higher porosity.
You're right, let's see -

It's not working


Oh, and I just want to post this here: http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...e&articleid=79

Wondering about that Goldwell "deposit only" color too.
Originally Posted by LilaGirl
The link you posted doesn't work --at least for me.
Originally Posted by JLeighs
3b/fine/normal porosity/normal elasticity

LOVES behentrimonium methosulfate
(don't ask me to pronounce that!)


Want to grow it long again!
And simply want to figure out this hair of mine!

Last edited by LilaGirl; 11-17-2012 at 07:46 PM.
Okay, going to read through these - can someone help me decipher these ingredients: - something in here could be messing with my hair? Roughing up the cuticle maybe?

Water, Laureth 23, Polyquaternium 4, Coral Flower (Russelia Equisetiformis) Extract, Prunus Persica Nectarina Fruit Extract, Fragrance, Propylene Glycol, Hydroxyethylcellulose, Benzyl Alcohol, Acrylates/Beheneth 25 Methacrylate Copolymer, Aminomethyl Propanol, DMDM Hydantoin, Acrylates Copolymer, Disodium EDTA
Originally Posted by LilaGirl
Yeah, I seriously had to just wash that out of my hair b/c I think it was damaging it! Woah.

So I left in My Honey Child Olive you deep condish - and that's it b/c every product I have now is going out the window! So I just put that in.

Oddly, though it says protein-free, but the ingredients seem Protein rich to me! We'll see - if anything it should be a nice little "treatment"

Water, Olea Europea (Olive) Fruit Oil,Honey, Olea Europea (Olive) Leaf Extract, Soya Milk (Glycine soja), Fresh Cantaloupe Melon (Cucumis Cantalupensis), Natural Yoghurt, , Olive Oil (Olea europaea), Avocado Oil (Persea gratissima), Seaweed , Jojoba Oil (Simmondsia chinensis), Violet Leaf Absolute (Viola odorata), Orange Blossom Absolute (Citrus dulcis), Neroli Oil (Citrus amara),

Ingredient Attributes: silicone free, sulfate free, paraben free, protein free, glycerin free
Originally Posted by LilaGirl
Ugg, sorry you're having such a tough time finding something that works. I wonder it it just didn't agree with another product you were using. Also, have you considered your water might be making your hair feel dry and brittle? How hard is the water in your area? Do you use a shower filter?

That MHC product is definitely not protein free. The glycine soja is soy protein and I believe seawood is also protein, but not positive about that.
3a (protein sensitive)
Fine, normal porosity, normal elasticity



Cleansers: Mop-C Hydrating Shampoo, JCGLS
Conditioners: CJCR, CK Renew
Leave-in: CJCR, CK Satin Roots
Stylers: HEBE, UFDCM
Deep Conditioner: CJCR
Standby items:GVP K-Pak
Jusduit, I used the HEBE with KCKT - and that's generally a safe one, no? All I know was that it got so bad, I had to wash it out and I left in the Olive you and so far it's fine? I think I do better with natural proteins - well see though if it gets tangled int he shower - that will be the sign.

But my water is pretty hard - my pots get mineral build up, etc.

I tried a softener once and my hair turned to mushy seaweed like I could never get it cleaned; it was the weirdest thing? Maybe I should try that again??
3b/fine/normal porosity/normal elasticity

LOVES behentrimonium methosulfate
(don't ask me to pronounce that!)


Want to grow it long again!
And simply want to figure out this hair of mine!
I have no problems using the KCKT with HEBE. A shower filter doesn't make the water soft, it just filters out certain chemicals and minerals depending on what filter you get. This is the shower filter we have and I think the refills are about $10, if I recall correctly. It mainly filters out chlorine but I can tell a difference in my hair (and skin). I'd love to get one that filters out some minerals but for now, I just poo once every week or two and I can tell a big difference even though the products I use supposedly don't build up. I actually think even conditioner builds up a teensy tiny bit. The shampoo I currently use has cocamidopropyl betaine but I'd like to find one a with a gentler cleanser that will also remove hard water buildup.

May I ask what you use the AOMM for? Is it for curl enhancement or more of a gel for hold? I can't recall if I every tried it or not. I'll have to check out the ingredients.
3a (protein sensitive)
Fine, normal porosity, normal elasticity



Cleansers: Mop-C Hydrating Shampoo, JCGLS
Conditioners: CJCR, CK Renew
Leave-in: CJCR, CK Satin Roots
Stylers: HEBE, UFDCM
Deep Conditioner: CJCR
Standby items:GVP K-Pak
Hmm... super busy here - will try to post that pick soon and highlights of my convo with MaryPat from livefree/curly -

But today I got very uncreative and used Rehab as a LI

I think I'm getting Oc'd - between the smoothing yesterday and the Rehab today as LIs, my hair is starting to get a little "mushy" -

I'm really still afraid to use protein but maybe I should either back off moisture or add protein?
Originally Posted by LilaGirl
I love the CJ Smoothing Leave-in but you only need a very small amount (I use about 1/2 a dime size for my whole head). Maybe you used too much?

I'm scared of protein too but I know I do need some occasionally. I don't ever do a protein treatment for very long or with heat. When my hair begins to get a little soft and limp, I will either use the GVP Joico KPak in the shower and rinse it out after about 3 minutes (sometimes less) or when I feel I need a little shot of protein, I will occasionally rotate a product which has protein such as:

Mop Top Daily Conditioner

Layer a small amount of BRHG over HEBE

CJ Curl Rehab (strawberry of course) (sometimes as a rinse-out or sometimes as a leave-in, again only a small amount)

Darcy's Botanicals Pumpkin Seed Moisturizing Conditioner (sometimes as a rinse-out or sometimes as a leave-in)

I used to rotate the CJ Argan Oil Conditioner but the skin on my shoulders reacts badly to it so I don't use it any more.

Basically, you can rotate anything in your product graveyard that your hair likes, as long as you don't use it every day. It's a way to get your hit of protein and use products you wouldn't otherwise be able to.

Everyone's different so you'll need to figure out which method and what kind of protein works best for you, but I would start slowly with adding protein back to your routine until you find out how much you can handle.

Oh and I can't wait to hear what Mary Pat had to say.
3a (protein sensitive)
Fine, normal porosity, normal elasticity



Cleansers: Mop-C Hydrating Shampoo, JCGLS
Conditioners: CJCR, CK Renew
Leave-in: CJCR, CK Satin Roots
Stylers: HEBE, UFDCM
Deep Conditioner: CJCR
Standby items:GVP K-Pak
I have no problems using the KCKT with HEBE. A shower filter doesn't make the water soft, it just filters out certain chemicals and minerals depending on what filter you get. This is the shower filter we have and I think the refills are about $10, if I recall correctly. It mainly filters out chlorine but I can tell a difference in my hair (and skin). I'd love to get one that filters out some minerals but for now, I just poo once every week or two and I can tell a big difference even though the products I use supposedly don't build up. I actually think even conditioner builds up a teensy tiny bit. The shampoo I currently use has cocamidopropyl betaine but I'd like to find one a with a gentler cleanser that will also remove hard water buildup.

May I ask what you use the AOMM for? Is it for curl enhancement or more of a gel for hold? I can't recall if I every tried it or not. I'll have to check out the ingredients.
Originally Posted by Jusduit
I just had AOMM on hand.

SO use a shower filter just to filter chlorine? Do you know one to get for the rest - at least minerals? I'll try it.
3b/fine/normal porosity/normal elasticity

LOVES behentrimonium methosulfate
(don't ask me to pronounce that!)


Want to grow it long again!
And simply want to figure out this hair of mine!
Hmm... super busy here - will try to post that pick soon and highlights of my convo with MaryPat from livefree/curly -

But today I got very uncreative and used Rehab as a LI

I think I'm getting Oc'd - between the smoothing yesterday and the Rehab today as LIs, my hair is starting to get a little "mushy" -

I'm really still afraid to use protein but maybe I should either back off moisture or add protein?
Originally Posted by LilaGirl
I love the CJ Smoothing Leave-in but you only need a very small amount (I use about 1/2 a dime size for my whole head). Maybe you used too much?

I'm scared of protein too but I know I do need some occasionally. I don't ever do a protein treatment for very long or with heat. When my hair begins to get a little soft and limp, I will either use the GVP Joico KPak in the shower and rinse it out after about 3 minutes (sometimes less) or when I feel I need a little shot of protein, I will occasionally rotate a product which has protein such as:

Mop Top Daily Conditioner

Layer a small amount of BRHG over HEBE

CJ Curl Rehab (strawberry of course) (sometimes as a rinse-out or sometimes as a leave-in, again only a small amount)

Darcy's Botanicals Pumpkin Seed Moisturizing Conditioner (sometimes as a rinse-out or sometimes as a leave-in)

I used to rotate the CJ Argan Oil Conditioner but the skin on my shoulders reacts badly to it so I don't use it any more.

Basically, you can rotate anything in your product graveyard that your hair likes, as long as you don't use it every day. It's a way to get your hit of protein and use products you wouldn't otherwise be able to.

Everyone's different so you'll need to figure out which method and what kind of protein works best for you, but I would start slowly with adding protein back to your routine until you find out how much you can handle.

Oh and I can't wait to hear what Mary Pat had to say.
Originally Posted by Jusduit
Wait, Rehab has protein????
3b/fine/normal porosity/normal elasticity

LOVES behentrimonium methosulfate
(don't ask me to pronounce that!)


Want to grow it long again!
And simply want to figure out this hair of mine!
Curl Rehab doesn't have the usual "protein", "hydrolyzed", or "amino acids" that are straight up proteins or pieces of a protein, but it does have herbal extracts. Any herbal extracts have trace amounts of protein, because plants contain a bit of protein. So, they can act like proteins for people whose hair is protein sensitive. See here.

Also, if you don't want to shell out for a shower filter yet, you might try rinsing with distilled water first. If that helps, then opt for a shower filter.
CG since 11/2011
2c /3a F /Mii, low porosity

Summer Products /Routine:
Clarifying: ACV rinses, Suave Professional Men Deep Clean Peppermint
Low Poo: Renpure Luxurious Argan Oil
Co-washes: VO5 Kiwi Lime Squeeze or Strawberries & Cream
RO: VO5 KLS or S&C, Cure Care
LI (if needed): VO5 S&C, VO5 SC, Cure Care
Stylers: FSG, AIF,
Tresemme Flawless Curls Bouncy Curls gel
PT: IAGirl's (link) as needed

Also, if you don't want to shell out for a shower filter yet, you might try rinsing with distilled water first. If that helps, then opt for a shower filter.
Originally Posted by Geek_Chic
I forgot about rinsing with distilled water! Before I figured out that coloring was trashing my hair, I started rinsing with distilled water as my final rinse. it helped and I'm not really sure why since we don't have hard water, but it definitely did make a difference.
2C/3A, fine, higher porosity.
Wow, could I be that sensitive to protein? Rehab isn't 100 percent amazing to me.

I did use coconut curlada last night as a leave in - used TONS and got amazing results and amazing second-day hair?!?!?

Purified Water, Cetyl Alcohol (derived from coconut) Stearalkonium Chloride, Cetearyl Alcohol (derived from coconut), Polysorbate 60, Virgin Coconut Oil (Cocos Hucifera), Panthenol, Certified Organic Arnica Flower Extract, Certified Organic Chamoile Flower Extract, Certified Organic White Tea Extract, Monoi de Tahiti, Methylheptyl Isostearate, Hydroxypropyltrimonium, Hydrolyzed Corn Starch, Potassium Sorbate, Phenoxyethanol, Caprylyl Glycol, Natural Fragrance,Caramel


I'll try it again (always the second time that things show up) but apparently I'm okay with panthenol and coconut? - there's no glycerin or aloe.
3b/fine/normal porosity/normal elasticity

LOVES behentrimonium methosulfate
(don't ask me to pronounce that!)


Want to grow it long again!
And simply want to figure out this hair of mine!
So basically, my talk with MaryPat from livecurlylivefree -

She is my 3c/fine-haired/coily hair twin.

She said she uses Suave and combines it (half and half) with a protein-heavy LI - with a gel like LA Looks

She uses palmfuls of LI - I said I just graduated from the school of thought that we had to use nickel-and-dime sizes. My hair needs palmfuls!

We talked about "pixie knots" and hair needing more moisture (right now with coconut curlada I have virtually no pixie knots!)

With tight coils, cuticle lifts more easily, lose moisture

She uses protein every time she wets hair

Loves BRHG also loves beauticurls as a LI

She uses light oils like coconut - might put some in ends at night and pineapple

I think that was about it - but I really don't think I can use protein. I'm curious what others have to say though about coconut curlada -
3b/fine/normal porosity/normal elasticity

LOVES behentrimonium methosulfate
(don't ask me to pronounce that!)


Want to grow it long again!
And simply want to figure out this hair of mine!
Curl Rehab doesn't have the usual "protein", "hydrolyzed", or "amino acids" that are straight up proteins or pieces of a protein, but it does have herbal extracts. Any herbal extracts have trace amounts of protein, because plants contain a bit of protein. So, they can act like proteins for people whose hair is protein sensitive. See here.

Also, if you don't want to shell out for a shower filter yet, you might try rinsing with distilled water first. If that helps, then opt for a shower filter.
Originally Posted by Geek_Chic
This.

There are a lot of threads about water filters, if you do a search. The only showerhead water softener I recall reading about was something called a ShowerStick but most of the threads are about water filters (chlorine). I prefer to use a shower filter and an occasional sulfate poo, while others prefer to use a clarifying conditioner or low poo (sulfate free) with EDTA (or other chelating ingredient) to help remove the build up from hard water.

ETA: Thanks for posting the highlights of your conversation with Mary Pat. I hope the coconut curlada continues to work well for you!
3a (protein sensitive)
Fine, normal porosity, normal elasticity



Cleansers: Mop-C Hydrating Shampoo, JCGLS
Conditioners: CJCR, CK Renew
Leave-in: CJCR, CK Satin Roots
Stylers: HEBE, UFDCM
Deep Conditioner: CJCR
Standby items:GVP K-Pak

Last edited by Jusduit; 11-20-2012 at 07:10 PM.
Oh, I didn't realize the diff. btwn a softner and a filter. But that makes sense. Though I TOTALLY didn't realize the need for doing some cleansing. That makes sense too. Hmm...

What's a cleansing condish? I do love a good prell wash from time to time, but I wonder if that is really too drying for me.
3b/fine/normal porosity/normal elasticity

LOVES behentrimonium methosulfate
(don't ask me to pronounce that!)


Want to grow it long again!
And simply want to figure out this hair of mine!

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