Argh what is wrong with my hair?

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Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 46
Can someone tell me what it means when your hair just ...rips..? well not ripping, Im being dramatic, it's just not snapping back it just pulls and rips off. =I

My hair was going amazing last week, I was using this product called marshmallow moisture balm, I only had a sample size, I ran out, and I am waiting for my larger order to come. When I was using that, my hair was buttery soft even naked without product, it retained better, the ends curled and didn't fuzz up one bit.

But why is it my hair isn't getting moisturized with washing with my shea moisture curl and shine shampoo, and the organicals DC?

I use to be able to pin point every issue my hair had and correct it.
But I am wondering what I need to change now. I love the organicals DC for it's slip but when I rinse it out it's like I never even DC'd.

To make matters worse, I thought it was a protein issue, so yesterday I decided...maybe it's time for a hard protein, I used aphogee 2 step.

It went okay, my hair has no adverse reactions to protein really, my hair actually loves protein and feels great after protein like always. I know it's a hard protein, I use it once out of maybe 4 or 5 months honestly. (My usual protein conditioner is two step)

My hair feels like it's 'usual' self but after using the marshmallow moisture balm, I realize that isn't good enough. It's thirsty for something, it's elasticity is lower than when I was using the balm.

I mean I just don't get it, I know my problem will be solved once I get the balm but I feel like some other things need to be changed >.< I'm just not sure what.

I just need some advice.

Last edited by Tinfoilhat; 11-29-2012 at 08:26 PM.
This makes me think about a relative of mine who is a computer engineer. People call with all sorts of problems with their computers and the first thing he tells them is to try turning the thing off then on again. Start simple and reboot.

With curly hair, sometimes when the problem seems kind of exotic and annoying, it's good to try hitting "reboot" by removing all product from your hair (shampoo with clarifying shampoo), then add conditioner and see if it's back to normal. While the protein can help you with elasticity, sounds like you've been using a lot of stylers (and products with shea butter can weigh down hair and make it act funny if used w/a heavy hand) ... So it could be that you have build up and/or are over-conditioned, which might explain the seeming loss of elasticity. Try shampooing from roots to end.

Other considerations: have you used any sort of chemical treatments in your hair (relaxers, "texturizers", demi or permanent hair color)?; Anything natural like henna, cassia or Amla? Do you use a lot of heat when you dry or style? In other words, are you doing anything that could lead to an altered hair pattern or hair damage?

Another thing is to explore is ingredients in the products you use. Do they contain a lot of glyerin or alcohol? Any "cones"?
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Last edited by Korkscrew; 11-30-2012 at 01:43 AM.
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I haven't been using alot of stylers actually, I only own two gels that I barely use actually. ^^;

I also clarify atleast once or twice a month, so It's not build up...I just shampooed the day before yesterday. And I don't use any products with shea butter in them, or cones. Glycerine agrees with my hair.

While resisting the urge to start cutting my hair off last night I did some googling and discovered that I maybe need to start focusing on moisture, and moisture retention more. I don't know why I didn't think of that as I was just ranting that my hair starting acting crazy again after running out of something had been upping my moisture levels. Then to add the aphogee two step to hair to remedy a DRY hair issue ..-.- I'm so stupid lol I usually never freak out and don't know what the issue is with my hair.

I am going on a full blown moisture regi. for atleast a month or so, with just light protein.
I just about had an anxiety attack while detangling the other day, I lost alot of hair on one side of my head, and now it looks like it's a bit shorter (this is also the side I sleep on so it's already different)....and I had a tiny set back in my nape area, nothing major but it is just different. I am usually sooooooo careful but I was just tired and frustrated while doing my hair that day, I don't know why. :/



I am wondering though, do you think it's possible for a conditioner to have a PH too high to penetrate and moisturize your hair? >.< I think that is the issue I'm having with my DC right now.
Maybe try cutting out the protein. It may not make your hair hard immediately - my hair felt great after protein treatments too, but cutting them out has been the best thing I've ever done for my hair. The awesome feeling it gave my hair didn't last and my hair always went back to being dry. Your hair may like it, but maybe it's just built up too much.

As for the deep conditioner maybe your hair is low-porosity? Do you know it's properties?
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 46
Maybe try cutting out the protein. It may not make your hair hard immediately - my hair felt great after protein treatments too, but cutting them out has been the best thing I've ever done for my hair. The awesome feeling it gave my hair didn't last and my hair always went back to being dry. Your hair may like it, but maybe it's just built up too much.

As for the deep conditioner maybe your hair is low-porosity? Do you know it's properties?
Originally Posted by SpiralSpunk
I can't cut out protein, for one the strands of my hair are fine and protein keeps them pliable and strong..and two, I have a chemical treatment in my hair.

I didn't want to mention the chemical treatment since I had been natural for 19 years before getting it done (I'm 21 now). before I got it I researched the chemical used, the process and the salon, the process is like a curly perm with liquid thio.
Only instead of being a double process, your hair is only processed once (like a texlax I guess) and the chemical is not as strong nor does it have as high as pH as sodium hydroxide. So the only real outcome of this process is the curl pattern is loosened yet much of your texture stays the same. My natural texture is 4A with a few 3C patches in the front of my hair. Medium thickness strands, high density.


Anyways the chemical I believe isn't the issue. ^^

But I do believe I need to learn the porosity of my hair. I never bothered because my hair seemed to fit the properties of both, my hair doesn't take super long to dry, but it doesn't dry insanely fast either. Yet my hair does seem to not be reacting or absorbing the higher pH deep conditioner. It sorta just works as a light styler on my hair when left on.

Do you think low porosity hair would not react to products of a higher pH?

Last edited by Tinfoilhat; 11-30-2012 at 12:48 PM.
Unless you've already trimmed/cut off all the chemically processed hair, I wouldn't assume it isn't playing a factor. If you have, great. If you haven't, you might want to trim or cut it now. Even something as mild as a demi-permanent color process can make hair over-porous and prone to all sorts of problems.

An ACV rinse (directions can be found on site) often works to restore pH balance, so you can first give that a try, but I doubt that's your whole problem.

I agree with you about checking your hair's properties, porosity in particular. Since you said you've lost elasticity, sounds like protein is probably not the culprit, but SpiralSpunk could be right and I could be wrong. Here's something you can do to try and figure out whether you're on protein overload, or need more moisture: First, do that clarifying wash to get everything out. Next, take a few samples of your hair from different areas of your head. DT with a quality conditioner that contains no protein. When done, take more samples of your hair. Is there more elasticity in your post-treatment hair? Less? The same? See how the hair on your head responds too.

A telltale sign of over-hydrated hair (hygral fatigue) is your hair will take even longer to dry after your DT, and it will have lost elasticity with "wilted" curl. It may also feel "spongy" ... If you see little to no difference w/this experiment, try another protein treatment - a serious reconstructor, like Aphogee or K-pak, leaving it on for 15-30 min.s - and repeat the steps above (hair samples) to gauge changes. A protein reaction includes stiff, dry hair that feels brittle and may even break off in places. So if it feels even more stiff and dry, protein could indeed be the culprit and you'd need to back off from that for a while until your hair is more balanced.
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I don't need to cut anything off as I am not transitioning, I have been natural for 19 years as I've said, and am only 21 now. I have had this process for two years now and have only had one touch up. I have not had any issues before this current issue which does seem to be using too much protein.

I've been natural for my entire life unlike most women, so I am pretty good at pin pointing issues with my hair. (I should also add that my hair doesn't suffer from length retention issues either) I am not new to curly, or natural hair at all.

I know all about ACV rinses, and other PH balancing rinses, I even own testing strips, I've done them in the past when I was trying out different things and hated all of it.

I think I have the issue down pact, since it is not an on-going issue, it's a moisture issue, and using too much protein. My hair seems to fit the description of low porosity hair, where it takes longer to absorb product. The DC I use currently rinses very clean from hair, and I realize that maybe my hair would be better of with a coating of some sort left behind, maybe not a cone but a heavy butter or oil, which my DC lacks.

So I think I am just going to be focusing on moisture for the time being and slowly add in protein treatments to avoid over moisturizing my hair.

Thank you guys for your input
Sometimes I just need to vent, and re-read to find the source of the problem. ^^


Unless you've already trimmed/cut off all the chemically processed hair, I wouldn't assume it isn't playing a factor. If you have, great. If you haven't, you might want to trim or cut it now. Even something as mild as a demi-permanent color process can make hair over-porous and prone to all sorts of problems.

An ACV rinse (directions can be found on site) often works to restore pH balance, so you can first give that a try, but I doubt that's your whole problem.

I agree with you about checking your hair's properties, porosity in particular. Since you said you've lost elasticity, sounds like protein is probably not the culprit, but SpiralSpunk could be right and I could be wrong. Here's something you can do to try and figure out whether you're on protein overload, or need more moisture: First, do that clarifying wash to get everything out. Next, take a few samples of your hair from different areas of your head. DT with a quality conditioner that contains no protein. When done, take more samples of your hair. Is there more elasticity in your post-treatment hair? Less? The same? See how the hair on your head responds too.

A telltale sign of over-hydrated hair (hygral fatigue) is your hair will take even longer to dry after your DT, and it will have lost elasticity with "wilted" curl. It may also feel "spongy" ... If you see little to no difference w/this experiment, try another protein treatment - a serious reconstructor, like Aphogee or K-pak, leaving it on for 15-30 min.s - and repeat the steps above (hair samples) to gauge changes. A protein reaction includes stiff, dry hair that feels brittle and may even break off in places. So if it feels even more stiff and dry, protein could indeed be the culprit and you'd need to back off from that for a while until your hair is more balanced.
Originally Posted by Korkscrew
I don't need to cut anything off as I am not transitioning, I have been natural for 19 years as I've said, and am only 21 now.
Originally Posted by Tinfoilhat
Some ppl still haven't grown/cut out chemically treated hair in two year time. That's why I asked.

I have had this process for two years now and have only had one touch up. I have not had any issues before this current issue which does seem to be using too much protein.
This means you've processed your hair twice in two years (a touch up counts as a chemical service). That can cause some damage. Not sure if it did in your case or not.

I've been natural for my entire life unlike most women, so I am pretty good at pin pointing issues with my hair. (I should also add that my hair doesn't suffer from length retention issues either) I am not new to curly, or natural hair at all.

I know all about ACV rinses, and other PH balancing rinses, I even own testing strips, I've done them in the past when I was trying out different things and hated all of it.
Just so you don't think I'm being condescending toward you: When I respond to posted questions, I do so with the assumption that the person asking may not be familiar w/everything out there (I have no way of knowing what the scope of your knowledge is ahead of time). I also post w/the understanding that there may be someone else w/the same question that could benefit from reading any info we all give. Anyway, I'm sorry these rinses didn't seem to help your hair and good luck with caring for your hair.
3b/c?

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Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 46
I'm sorry if I ame off defensive, I'm just use to newly natural, or girls who are just learning to care for curly hair properly giving me advice like I am new to curly/natural hair when I've had it all my life. (this is my first, and only chemical treatment ever) ^^

Also I know the chemical is not the issue I had my retouch around last Feb., and seeing as dryness is not a usual issue of mine. Usually my hair is in pretty perfect condition. I just think my DC is not penetrating very well, possibly due to the overuse of protein, or because the pH is not suitable for my hair.

I'm gonna try a lower pH dc, and lay off the protein for a few a few weeks, and slowly add it in before my hair gets overly mushy from moisture >.<

I don't need to cut anything off as I am not transitioning, I have been natural for 19 years as I've said, and am only 21 now.
Originally Posted by Tinfoilhat
Some ppl still haven't grown/cut out chemically treated hair in two year time. That's why I asked.

I have had this process for two years now and have only had one touch up. I have not had any issues before this current issue which does seem to be using too much protein.
This means you've processed your hair twice in two years (a touch up counts as a chemical service). That can cause some damage. Not sure if it did in your case or not.

I've been natural for my entire life unlike most women, so I am pretty good at pin pointing issues with my hair. (I should also add that my hair doesn't suffer from length retention issues either) I am not new to curly, or natural hair at all.

I know all about ACV rinses, and other PH balancing rinses, I even own testing strips, I've done them in the past when I was trying out different things and hated all of it.
Just so you don't think I'm being condescending toward you: When I respond to posted questions, I do so with the assumption that the person asking may not be familiar w/everything out there (I have no way of knowing what the scope of your knowledge is ahead of time). I also post w/the understanding that there may be someone else w/the same question that could benefit from reading any info we all give. Anyway, I'm sorry these rinses didn't seem to help your hair and good luck with caring for your hair.
Originally Posted by Korkscrew
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 46
Okay the issue was def. too much protein usage.

I usually wash every weekend, use aphogee two minute, and then DC with my organicals deep conditioning creme.

I didn't wash today, but I did rinse long, and then applied a mixture of my organicals DC with honey, and left it on for about two and a half hours.

My hair is buttery soft right now. =D


My marshmallow moisture balm also arrived the other day, so I have been using that mixed with my leave in and my moisture has been balancing out with the protein. I'm happy again. ^^ In a few weeks I'm gonna lightly blow out my hair and inspect to see if I did any major damage to any areas I might not be able to see, so far it only looks like I had a small set back in my nape area on one side.


I should hide my protein conditioners from myself because it's such a bad habit of mine to try and remedy any issue with PROTEIN, lol. >.<;



Okay so one more question, do you guys think a conditioner with hydrolyzed wheat protein would be okay to start using weekly for my moisture-focus regi. ?

I think it's a moisturizing protein, I know it's not strong.
Glad you found the problem. I was actually going to respond and agree with Korkscrew that it probably wasn't a protein problem since you're processed, but you figured it out.

HWP is a big nono for me personally and I've never heard of it being considered a more moisturizing one,
but I really don't know as I avoid any obvious protein.

It would help if we knew the thickness of your strands.
If your hair is fine and low-porosity then from what I've seen theres a big chance that your hair is not protein sensitive.

Also depending on what kind of products you use (are you fine free?) the problem just could have been build up - if not silicone then protein.

If it was not build up then heat should really help your DCs.
What's tha name of the product?
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 46
Glad you found the problem. I was actually going to respond and agree with Korkscrew that it probably wasn't a protein problem since you're processed, but you figured it out.

HWP is a big nono for me personally and I've never heard of it being considered a more moisturizing one,
but I really don't know as I avoid any obvious protein.

It would help if we knew the thickness of your strands.
If your hair is fine and low-porosity then from what I've seen theres a big chance that your hair is not protein sensitive.

Also depending on what kind of products you use (are you fine free?) the problem just could have been build up - if not silicone then protein.

If it was not build up then heat should really help your DCs.
Originally Posted by SpiralSpunk

My hair isn't protein sensitive, I don't even believe in protein "sensitivity" I just think many women with natural hair use too strong protein treatments, or used it too often and natural hair doesn't need protein as often or as hard as processed hair. I was just using too much protein, too often, and then tipped myself over to protein-overload a bit with the two step treatment.

My hair is medium-thickness strands, even processed, they don't break easily.


What's tha name of the product?
Originally Posted by Amethyst_Kisses
Which product? my DC?

It's the organicals DC creme ^^
Glad you found the problem. I was actually going to respond and agree with Korkscrew that it probably wasn't a protein problem since you're processed, but you figured it out.

HWP is a big nono for me personally and I've never heard of it being considered a more moisturizing one,
but I really don't know as I avoid any obvious protein.

It would help if we knew the thickness of your strands.
If your hair is fine and low-porosity then from what I've seen theres a big chance that your hair is not protein sensitive.

Also depending on what kind of products you use (are you fine free?) the problem just could have been build up - if not silicone then protein.

If it was not build up then heat should really help your DCs.
Originally Posted by SpiralSpunk

My hair isn't protein sensitive, I don't even believe in protein "sensitivity" I just think many women with natural hair use too strong protein treatments, or used it too often and natural hair doesn't need protein as often or as hard as processed hair. I was just using too much protein, too often, and then tipped myself over to protein-overload a bit with the two step treatment.

My hair is medium-thickness strands, even processed, they don't break easily.


What's tha name of the product?
Originally Posted by Amethyst_Kisses
Which product? my DC?

It's the organicals DC creme ^^
Originally Posted by Tinfoilhat
No the one you had to wait to get in the mail

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