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-   -   Is this from porosity? (http://www.naturallycurly.com/curltalk/general-discussion-about-curly-hair/153039-porosity.html)

gardencurls 12-18-2012 01:27 PM

Is this from porosity?
 
I decided to try a new product this morning because today is a day I can look like a troll doll with relatively few people seeing me. It's a good thing I chose today, because I do, indeed, look like a troll doll.

I used a sulfate-free "shampoo" with excellent ingredients. The shampoo was creamy, elegant, and a little foamy. I could even run my fingers through some of my hair while the shampoo was in it.

Problems occurred when it came time to rinse. I could not get the stuff out of my hair. I rinsed and rinsed and rinsed and rinsed. I applied my conditioner and it burst into foam. So I rinsed and rinsed and rinsed, and after I shook my head I could hear that sparkly sound like bubbles popping in my hair! I was already freaked out because I was wasting water (I usually rinse in a sink or a tub and don't run the water), so I got out my Kinky Curly shampoo, and scrubbed my hair, even though it wasn't time for clarifying.

This "shampoo" is an extreme example, but I often deal with that foaming problem when applying products, and I'm wondering if it has to do with porosity. I've read that low porosity, which I seem to have, can cause some of this, but I don't understand how it could cause that with a shampoo, which is supposed to remove product from hair.

adthomas 12-18-2012 01:59 PM

Can you list ingredients? Some shampoos have cones. I used that Ion sulfate free shampoo years ago and later noticed it had a cone.

gardencurls 12-18-2012 04:44 PM

Ingredients: Prunis Persica extract, Pimpenella anisum fruit extract, Panax Ginseng root extract, Ginkgo Bilobika extract, cetraria islandica extract, saccharomyces cerevisiea extract in purified water, sodium myreth solfate . C14-16 olefin sulfonate, cocomidopropyl betaine, hydrolyzed wheat protein, tocopherol acetate, Panthenol, glycol distearate, polyquaternium-10 polysaccharide celulose, DMDM Hydantoin, methlyparaben (USP), propylparaben, benzophenone-4, fragrance, D&C orange 4CI 15510

Do some silicones foam? Now that you mentioned it...over the weekend I went to the ballet, so I dressed up, and I used hairspray. I use hairspray once or twice a year, so I forgot that I'd had it in my hair. I think I co-washed with Hair One on Sunday night and everything seemed normal, but now I can't remember if I co-washed or just rinsed with Honeysuckle-Rose. Maybe I just needed a good clarifying wash and I didn't realize I had build up.

gardencurls 12-20-2012 05:14 PM

My curiosity, and dry hair, led me to shampoo again this morning, and I used the Elucence again. I washed my daughter's hair with it and it worked beautifully. For my hair, I used a small amount, and it fizzed up like in an old Prell commercial. The only thing that's been in my hair is a gel that I've used for years.

The same foaming thing happened when I tried to rinse. I could not rinse this stuff out of my hair. When I added conditioner, it foamed up like shampoo, and even after rinsing like crazy, when I added my curl cream, it literally lathered up like sudsy shampoo!

Again with the troll doll look today...

What on earth could cause this?

Sandi 12-20-2012 11:30 PM

I honestly don't know (I'm also low porosity, by the way). There are some things that I use that foam, but a change in application has helped this. For example, when I use GDLI, I must apply it to damp, not wet hair, or else it foams like mad.

Today, my AO Camillia Rose also kinda foamed, though after a little bit of steaming and combing through the hair, the foaming stopped, and I washed it out.

Maybe it was the poly-quats or the sulfate family stuff? Though today, I washed with Burt's Bees Gud shampoo, which has the same cleaning ingredient, and I didn't have any issues.

Is the product still in your hair, by the way? I can't really tell from your description whether the foaming is an aftermath thing, or you still can't wash it entirely out of the hair.

gardencurls 12-21-2012 01:15 PM

1 Attachment(s)
This is seriously BAD. My oldest son comes home from college yesterday, looks at me, and says, "Interesting look, Mom. Tina Turner? 1980s? I'm not sure you can pull it off." (!!)

My hair felt like I'd let shampoo dry in it. It was sticky, and nasty.

No SLS or ALS has touched my hair for years, but I was so frustrated I dug out some samples of Sodium Laureth Sulfate shampoo and I washed my hair twice with it. Still the foaming and stickiness! So I washed my hair with about a 1/2 cup of baking soda and water.

It actually felt better after that. I left GVP Balm on it for awhile, rinsed, and it dried while I was sleeping. This morning I looked like Robert Smith from The Cure circa 1986, so I wet my hair. It seemed okay. I put in some DevaCare gel...and bam! The sudsing again!

It must be something in the water, maybe? I moved here to AZ last summer from Southern CA (which actually has worse water than AZ). Maybe there's some chemical change this time of year in the water supply? I don't know. My hair is matting up in balls, and I can see suds in the straw-like knots. I don't think the baking soda has rinsed out completely yet either...

Just when it seemed like my hair was finally growing and doing well...LOL!
If only I had Tina Turner's legs...

kathymack 12-22-2012 10:46 AM

The shampoo has several surfactants in it. They cause the foaming.

Morgan_Adcock 12-22-2012 11:32 AM

Your "excellent" shampoo is a full poo.

Ingredients: Prunis Persica extract, Pimpenella anisum fruit extract, Panax Ginseng root extract, Ginkgo Bilobika extract, cetraria islandica extract, saccharomyces cerevisiea extract in purified water, sodium myreth solfate . C14-16 olefin sulfonate, cocomidopropyl betaine, hydrolyzed wheat protein, tocopherol acetate, Panthenol, glycol distearate, polyquaternium-10 polysaccharide celulose, DMDM Hydantoin, methlyparaben (USP), propylparaben, benzophenone-4, fragrance, D&C orange 4CI 15510

bookgirl 12-22-2012 03:08 PM

I usually get a lot of foaming from products containing coco betaine, even if they are labeled low-lather. I tend to add a lot of water to my hair during the washing/cowashing process to make sure the product is evenly distributed, and that usually = lots of lather. (My hair is very porous, for what it's worth).

Morgan_Adcock 12-22-2012 07:02 PM

Getting a lot of foaming from products containing coco betaine doesn't change the fact that sodium myreth sulfate is a sulfate detergent, which means this isn't a low poo.

Jessiebanana 12-22-2012 08:53 PM

Olefin sulfonate is just as foamy as SLS in my hair...sometime worse I think because they use more of it.

opasna 12-22-2012 09:08 PM

Olefin sulfonate is just as harsh as sls too (it says so on the ingredients link thing)

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Morgan_Adcock 12-23-2012 03:27 PM

Good catch! I just skimmed after I got to the first sulfate detergent.

Sadly, a lot of personal care product manufacturers either think consumers don't care about any sulfates other than sodium laurel/laureth sulfate, or they don't know enough to realise that the "substitutes" they're using are also sulfates.

Not to mention that if they load a low-poo up with several non-sulfate detergents, they're causing as much damage (or more), and not doing the consumer any favours. The first "low-poo" I used was entirely sulfate free, but chocked full of non-sulfate detergents, and stripped all the good stuff out of my hair. Fortunately, I figured out quickly that it didn't conform to the spirit of low-pooing, and re-consigned it to scrubbing my toilet, for which it was much better suited.


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