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-   -   Cocamidopropyl Betaine Only 'Poo? (http://www.naturallycurly.com/curltalk/general-discussion-about-curly-hair/155118-cocamidopropyl-betaine-only-poo.html)

Hootenanny 02-14-2013 07:13 PM

Cocamidopropyl Betaine Only 'Poo?
 
Hi everyone,
I'm looking for a 'poo that has Cocamidopropyl Betaine as the ONLY clarifying agent. So, not one that is mixed with Olefin Sulfonate (like KC Come Clean), or with Sodium Lauroyl Lactylate (like Renpure). Does such a 'poo exist? If you know of one, please share! :)

coilynapp 02-14-2013 08:39 PM

CAPB is not a primary surfactant and therefore will not be present in any formulation on its own. It is not as effective on its own. It is a foam booster for other surfactants and makes anionic surfs milder.

If you are seeking a more gentle shampoo, look for shampoos that have conditioning ingredients in them. Come Clean was a horrible shampoo IME.

juanab 02-14-2013 09:38 PM

I like Come Clean once I learned how to use it on my hair. 1 part shampoo, 2 parts filtered water. It clarifies and doesn't strip.

coilynapp 02-14-2013 10:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by juanab (Post 2120216)
I like Come Clean once I learned how to use it on my hair. 1 part shampoo, 2 parts filtered water. It clarifies and doesn't strip.

That's great but I firmly believe that you should not have to do that. If I buy a product, I don't want to doctor it up just to use it unless the directions tell me so.


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Jessiebanana 02-15-2013 12:55 AM

Jessicurl Hair Cleansing Cream is the lowest poo you'll find. It's the only poo I could tolerate. There is more than one surfactant, but they are all gentle.

Water (Aqua), Decyl Polyglucose, Sodium Cocoyl Isethionate, Cocamidopropyl Betaine, Vegetable Glycerin, Behentrimonium Methosulfate (and) Cetearyl Alcohol, Persea Gratissima (Avocado) Oil, Guar Hydroxypropyltrimonium Chloride, C 12-15 Alkyl Benzoate, PEG 150 Pentaerythrityl Tetrastearate, Diazolidinyl Urea (and) Iodopropynyl Butylcarbamate

Jessiebanana 02-15-2013 12:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coilynapp (Post 2120247)
Quote:

Originally Posted by juanab (Post 2120216)
I like Come Clean once I learned how to use it on my hair. 1 part shampoo, 2 parts filtered water. It clarifies and doesn't strip.

That's great but I firmly believe that you should not have to do that. If I buy a product, I don't want to doctor it up just to use it unless the directions tell me so.


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I agree you shouldn't have to work with products. This shampoo is obviously stripping from the ingredients though. It's a classic example of why you should ignore the claims of the product and skip straight to the back.

juanab 02-15-2013 07:11 AM

Interesting thoughts ladies. What say you when someone adds oils or AVJ to a product to "kick it up a notch" or make it work better for their hair? Ala the Kimmaytube leave-in with KCKT or those who put shampoo or oil in their conditioner? Isn't that the same principle?

Making it work, sure beats chucking it in the trash. And if it works, you have a go to if you need it without having to look for something else and hope that it works as is.

However, I get your point.

lucyprimrose 02-15-2013 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coilynapp (Post 2120182)
CAPB is not a primary surfactant and therefore will not be present in any formulation on its own. It is not as effective on its own. It is a foam booster for other surfactants and makes anionic surfs milder.

If you are seeking a more gentle shampoo, look for shampoos that have conditioning ingredients in them. Come Clean was a horrible shampoo IME.

That's interesting. Do you know about conditioners that have Coco Betaine in without any other surfactants? I always thought they might be more cleansing as a co wash but maybe I was wrong. The one I'm thinking of is an Urtekram one that sometimes says coco glycerides but is coco betaine according to the bottle -

Ingredients
Water, coconut oil products, vegetable glycerine*, apricot kernel oil*, shea butter*, corn starch*, vegetable polysaccharides, citric acid, levulinic acid, citrus seed extract, anisic acid, rose geranium oil*, rose extract*, vegetable vitamin E. *

International list of ingredients (INCI)2010: Aqua, cetyl alcohol, glycerin*, prunus armeniaca kernel oil*, cocamidopropyl betaine, butyrospermum parkii butter*, zea mays starch*, xanthan gum, glyceryl caprylate, levulinic acid, citrus grandis seed extract, citric acid, sodium citrate, p-anisic acid, pelargonium graveolens oli* (aroma), rosa damascena extract*, tocopheryl acetate, citral", citronellol", geraniol", limonene", linalool". * from Organic farming. "Essential oil.

Hootenanny 02-15-2013 03:15 PM

Thanks for all the info, ladies! I would also be interested in finding a conditioner with Coco Betaine and/or Cocamidopropyl Betaine. Anyone have any suggestions?

lucyprimrose 02-15-2013 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hootenanny (Post 2120563)
Thanks for all the info, ladies! I would also be interested in finding a conditioner with Coco Betaine and/or Cocamidopropyl Betaine. Anyone have any suggestions?

The one I use that has Coco Betaine in is the Urtekram conditioner, I used the rose and the aloe vera variations, they both have it in. I don't know if you can get it in the USA, I think it is a Danish brand but it is available online in the Uk from lots of websites so it may be international.

coilynapp 02-15-2013 03:28 PM

coco glycerides is a different ingredient from cocamidopropyl betaine. I'm not sure I understand your post lucyprimrose. I don't see glycerides in the first ingredient list.

Juana, I get adding oils to conditioners to make them better. I did this with the cheapy conditioners (V05) as they usually do not have oil in them. I don't think there is anything wrong with doctoring up a product by adding oil for your personal use, but really, I would rather just buy a product that works for my hair.

Jessiebanana 02-15-2013 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by juanab (Post 2120303)
Interesting thoughts ladies. What say you when someone adds oils or AVJ to a product to "kick it up a notch" or make it work better for their hair? Ala the Kimmaytube leave-in with KCKT or those who put shampoo or oil in their conditioner? Isn't that the same principle?

Making it work, sure beats chucking it in the trash. And if it works, you have a go to if you need it without having to look for something else and hope that it works as is.

However, I get your point.

I understand that. I'm not a product hoarder, so I will take action on a product I don't like. I usually will return it. If I can't return it I will doctor it up or if it's doing bad things to my hair I'll throw it out or give/swap/sell it away. What I mean is, I'm not going to pay a lot for a product I essentially have to make. It one thing to buy oils, butters, glycerine, essential oils, etc. and make something from scratch or improve on a $1 conditioner. It's another thing to pay $10-$30 for a product an have to make alterations. That is a will-not-purchase-again type of thing.

juanab 02-15-2013 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jessiebanana (Post 2120577)
Quote:

Originally Posted by juanab (Post 2120303)
Interesting thoughts ladies. What say you when someone adds oils or AVJ to a product to "kick it up a notch" or make it work better for their hair? Ala the Kimmaytube leave-in with KCKT or those who put shampoo or oil in their conditioner? Isn't that the same principle?

Making it work, sure beats chucking it in the trash. And if it works, you have a go to if you need it without having to look for something else and hope that it works as is.

However, I get your point.

I understand that. I'm not a product hoarder, so I will take action on a product I don't like. I usually will return it. If I can't return it I will doctor it up or if it's doing bad things to my hair I'll throw it out or give/swap/sell it away. What I mean is, I'm not going to pay a lot for a product I essentially have to make. It one thing to buy oils, butters, glycerine, essential oils, etc. and make something from scratch or improve on a $1 conditioner. It's another thing to pay $10-$30 for a product an have to make alterations. That is a will-not-purchase-again type of thing.

Totally get it and agree.

juanab 02-15-2013 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coilynapp (Post 2120568)
coco glycerides is a different ingredient from cocamidopropyl betaine. I'm not sure I understand your post lucyprimrose. I don't see glycerides in the first ingredient list.

Juana, I get adding oils to conditioners to make them better. I did this with the cheapy conditioners (V05) as they usually do not have oil in them. I don't think there is anything wrong with doctoring up a product by adding oil for your personal use, but really, I would rather just buy a product that works for my hair.

Same here Coily.

lucyprimrose 02-15-2013 05:39 PM

[QUOTE=coilynapp;2120568]coco glycerides is a different ingredient from cocamidopropyl betaine. I'm not sure I understand your post lucyprimrose. I don't see glycerides in the first ingredient list.
QUOTE]

Sorry. It did come out confusing. What I copied in was two lists of ingredients both given underneath the product online - you know how the international list is sometimes phrased differently but it is the same stuff - I assume the 'coconut oil products' are the coco betaine. On another website it said coco glycerides rather than either of the above. Anyway, doesn't matter, I was just wondering whether coco betaine can have any cleansing/surfactant power in that formulation since it is the only surfactant. That's why I was using it but after I read your post earlier I thought maybe it couldn't. I'll probably use it anyway as it is a good co wash.

Sorry for confusion!

coilynapp 02-23-2013 07:18 PM

[QUOTE=lucyprimrose;2120638]
Quote:

Originally Posted by coilynapp (Post 2120568)
coco glycerides is a different ingredient from cocamidopropyl betaine. I'm not sure I understand your post lucyprimrose. I don't see glycerides in the first ingredient list.
QUOTE]

Sorry. It did come out confusing. What I copied in was two lists of ingredients both given underneath the product online - you know how the international list is sometimes phrased differently but it is the same stuff - I assume the 'coconut oil products' are the coco betaine. On another website it said coco glycerides rather than either of the above. Anyway, doesn't matter, I was just wondering whether coco betaine can have any cleansing/surfactant power in that formulation since it is the only surfactant. That's why I was using it but after I read your post earlier I thought maybe it couldn't. I'll probably use it anyway as it is a good co wash.

Sorry for confusion!

It sounds like a good co wash. But say if you have a bunch of gunk in your hair, that's not going to give you a good enough clean.

lucyprimrose 02-24-2013 09:14 AM

Thanks Coilynapp :smile:

GoldenBlaze 02-24-2013 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by juanab (Post 2120303)
Interesting thoughts ladies. What say you when someone adds oils or AVJ to a product to "kick it up a notch" or make it work better for their hair? Ala the Kimmaytube leave-in with KCKT or those who put shampoo or oil in their conditioner? Isn't that the same principle?

Making it work, sure beats chucking it in the trash. And if it works, you have a go to if you need it without having to look for something else and hope that it works as is.

However, I get your point.

I agree! I like Kinky Curly Come Clean and it does not strip my hair and its because I only use a dime size amount in the shower. If a product doesnt work, Ill prepoo or do whatever I can to use a product I purchase so that it doesn't go to waste.

etos 02-25-2013 09:48 AM

Curl junkie daily fix and jessicurl gentle lather shampoo both have only that clarifying agent in it

coilynapp 02-25-2013 11:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by etos (Post 2126270)
Curl junkie daily fix and jessicurl gentle lather shampoo both have only that clarifying agent in it

I believe both these products have other surfs. People dot tend to think of btms as a surf, but it is--just a different category than the typical shampoo detergents. It does have some cleansing power as does centrimonium chloride and polysorbate. Emulsifiers can emulsify oils enabling them to be washed away. They do not foam much but can in specific formulations. For instance, you may notice your conditioner foaming even when it doesn't have typical shampoo detergents. The mentioned products are gentle cream cleansers which are different from traditional shampoos. Good options for the low poo/no poo ladies.


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