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Old 07-19-2013, 08:58 AM   #21
 
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about the cotton seed curl booster: I think I like it...
I didn't have bad experiences with it yet, but I didn't use it the last 3 weeks or so because I'm experimenting with KCCC...

I did have great results using it on dry hair though! So it might have good 2nd day hair performance.

I am a bit afraid to use it though since it has 2 polyquats (37 and 72 or something like that) and I am afraid of using any polyquat and MO although I don't think I had bad results using them earlier (I'm just afraid of ingredients that give people bad results... paranoia I guess)

I would say: try one bottle and you will know if you like it or not?
I liked it but the polyquats scare me... (probably for no reason though, I'm just in a "scared of a lot of ingredients"-period I think)
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Old 07-19-2013, 09:24 AM   #22
 
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I just wanted to post my thoughts on natural products. I completely agree with Jessiebanana that it is erroneous to conflate "natural" with "safe." On a chemical level, molecules are molecules anyway, and if an ingredient "sounds chemical-y" it doesn't mean it's bad for you or your hair fatty alcohols being a good example.

That being said, I do like to run my products and ingredients by Skin Deep, and I'll spend time on the site discovering new companies as well. Skin Deep® Cosmetics Database | Environmental Working Group Interestingly, the small natural boutiques that have a health and eco-conscious approach often score the best. Generally these kinds of companies tend to avoid putting things like parabens and DMDM hydantoin in their products. I'm talking about the companies that are dedicated to their cause, not the greenwashing types.

Bigger companies can certainly make safe products, but often I run into situations like this one: I just bought the CeraVe cleanser and lotion which I've been using on my face, and i really like it, think it's helping with my acne, except it has parabens in it. The product scored well on the site, except for the parabens. This really annoys me, I don't really want to use something that is good for my skin but ultimately bad for my body.

If you're using something on your skin or hair that is actually edible like FSG (would probably taste bad) there's no way that it could worse for you than a store-bought gel (unless of course, you're allergic to flax or it's gone bad).
A well-formulated health-oriented store-bought gel shouldn't be a problem however. You have to dig a little bit, run some searches and make the best decision based on all the literature available at the time of purchase. In the long run, we may find that even more ingredients are possibly problematic, even the ones deemed safe at one point. This gives some people the attitude of "well I'll just use whatever anyway." I disagree with this. If an ingredient has links to cancer I don't see any reason why I would continue using it. If other ingredients are deemed not as safe in the future, then I'll stop using those as well.
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Old 07-19-2013, 09:26 AM   #23
 
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Quote:
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about the cotton seed curl booster: I think I like it...
I didn't have bad experiences with it yet, but I didn't use it the last 3 weeks or so because I'm experimenting with KCCC...

I did have great results using it on dry hair though! So it might have good 2nd day hair performance.

I am a bit afraid to use it though since it has 2 polyquats (37 and 72 or something like that) and I am afraid of using any polyquat and MO although I don't think I had bad results using them earlier (I'm just afraid of ingredients that give people bad results... paranoia I guess)

I would say: try one bottle and you will know if you like it or not?
I liked it but the polyquats scare me... (probably for no reason though, I'm just in a "scared of a lot of ingredients"-period I think)
Okay, there is no point in being afraid of something you've already purchased. Second, not all polyquats are the same and lastly a large number of people have no issues with polyquats. Those of us who've had issues come on here to share our experiences in the hopes they may help someone who is having unexplainable problems with their hair...not to scare the living daylights out of people.

Even if you did, simply clarify and don't use them again. It really isn't worth worrying about. I promise.
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Old 07-19-2013, 09:57 AM   #24
 
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Thank you for the link wavydaze! I just bought a natures gate shampoo today and I checked it there, what an eye opener! If I buy a run of the mill hair product like suave I don't expect a good score, but a "natural" product , I would expect more!
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Old 07-19-2013, 10:19 AM   #25
 
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I love the curl cream, I use the shampoo mixed with a little of my own condish and seems to work ok. Not that taken o the rainforest conditioners but would like to try the banana one...

My body shop did trial sizes of the shampoo and condish so I've tried most of them.

In terms of commercial products I like the body shop range better than treseme naturals....
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Old 07-19-2013, 10:44 AM   #26
 
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Originally Posted by turquoisecurls View Post
Thank you for the link wavydaze! I just bought a natures gate shampoo today and I checked it there, what an eye opener! If I buy a run of the mill hair product like suave I don't expect a good score, but a "natural" product , I would expect more!
Which NG shampoo was it and what ingredients were the biggest offenders? I think NG is one of the better brands out there but it may depend on specific product. I really like their conditioners! I just did a search on them and it seems most of them get a 4 from Skin Deep with the biggest offender being fragrance. I think a score of 4 is okay, but of course if I find a similar condish with a score of 0 or 1 then I'll switch to that one!
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Old 07-19-2013, 11:23 AM   #27
 
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Neleke, I'm with Jessiebanana. If you don't experience any problems, then don't be afraid to use it. So many people here can't use glycerin and stay away from it whereas I rarely get any frizz from glycerin. I'm not afraid to use it because I know I don't get the bad reaction most people get.

Also, I think you hear so many negative things about polyquats because people only bring it up when they have problems with them, and not when everything's fine. Most people probably don't experience any problems with polyquats but we don't notice because it's not out there on the boards.

Wavydaze, thank you so much for your contribution and sharing your views as well as the Skin Deep Cosmetic Database. I'm going to run some products in the database as soon as I'm done typing this post!

Laura1982, what curl cream are you talking about? Is the Cottonseed curl booster a cream? Please tell me more about it!

I'm so happy with all the responses. Please keep them coming!

By the way, the Cottonseed Curl Booster is just €6,- now. Bit scared of the polyquats though because they have caused problems for me in the past. Oh what to do, what to do.
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Old 07-19-2013, 01:24 PM   #28
 
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Yes - it's the cottonseed curl booster - I have fine hair, 2b/c, normal porisity so anything heavy or rich doesn't work for me. The curl cream is light weight, not greasy, seems to reduce frizz (although I don't get much) and has a light hold. I'm not sure about clumping as I finger twist.... I tend to apply it when my hair is quite wet, plop then twist...
HTH
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Old 07-19-2013, 03:51 PM   #29
 
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I love the Skin Deep site. I never buy a sunscreen without checking there first.

That said there are products I use even if they score badly. For example my Paula's Choice products. I have not ever ever found anything that has helped my acne and complexion as much as her products. So I look at the ingredients and weight the risks vs. benefits.

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Old 07-19-2013, 04:52 PM   #30
 
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I would just try one bottle of the curl booster.

Jessiebanana & Lauraimes: I will try not to be afraid again... but it's just that I easily get frizz, and I don't need more of that (I'm also avoiding humectants now, but that's also because our dews are around 65 now). I think I am scared that my hair will gradually get worse, not at once, and that I won't be able to notice myself what the thing causing the bad results would be... I guess that's why I trying to avoid almost everything people have problems with, although that seems to be quite impossible.

I promise I will use the curl booster tomorrow . (I've had 2-3 weeks of KCCC experimenting, so now I can use another thing again without experimenting too much).
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Old 07-20-2013, 12:28 AM   #31
 
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Laura1982, sounds very promising! My hair also gets weighed down easily so I could definitely benefit from something that is lightweight. I always apply product on really wet hair, then plop. I don't twist but clumping is not really a major thing for me. It's nice when it clumps but if I get less clumps, I get more volume which is just as nice. Do you use it alone or with other products? I'm asking because layering doesn't work for me, so I use one styling product at a time.

Neleke, being scared is definitely not helping your hair journey. Notice that polyquats usually don't result in frizz unless your hair is wet. I remember I used a gel that had them and whenever it rained, I got massive frizz, but never when wet. That's why I think you shouldn't worry about frizz, especially not if you don't experience any other problems (like build-up - that's the main reason for me to avoid polyquats).

By avoiding everything that other people have problems with is quite a difficult task indeed, and what's worse is that you might even miss out on some ingredients that might work wonders for you! I think you'll notice what changes your hair soon enough if you don't experiment too much and observe your hair closely.

And you don't have to promise us anything How's KCCC working out for you? It's been on my list since forever so I'm curious.
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Old 07-20-2013, 04:09 AM   #32
 
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I use the curl cream on its own - the only other thing in my hair is my LI with a bit of honey...

My hair doesn't like to many products - it ends up flat and limp... :/
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Old 07-20-2013, 05:05 AM   #33
 
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Quote:
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Laura1982, what curl cream are you talking about? Is the Cottonseed curl booster a cream? Please tell me more about it!

I'm so happy with all the responses. Please keep them coming!

By the way, the Cottonseed Curl Booster is just €6,- now. Bit scared of the polyquats though because they have caused problems for me in the past. Oh what to do, what to do.
Which specific polyquats have caused a problem for you in the past? It's a massive family and they don't all have the same properties - really it is as much a naming system as anything. It's a little like surfactants: the anionics (including foamy sulphates) do not behave the same as the cationics (the ones in conditioner). Maybe do as KathyMack has and analyse your products based on ingredients until you have a short list of possible culprits?

The curl booster is a liquidy lotion consistency so easy to spread, the bottle is a pump not a spray as it looks like. It definitely does something, even in fairly small amounts: less seems to be more which makes it more economical!
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Old 07-20-2013, 05:36 AM   #34
 
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Quote:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lauraimes View Post
Laura1982, what curl cream are you talking about? Is the Cottonseed curl booster a cream? Please tell me more about it!

I'm so happy with all the responses. Please keep them coming!

By the way, the Cottonseed Curl Booster is just €6,- now. Bit scared of the polyquats though because they have caused problems for me in the past. Oh what to do, what to do.
Which specific polyquats have caused a problem for you in the past? It's a massive family and they don't all have the same properties - really it is as much a naming system as anything. It's a little like surfactants: the anionics (including foamy sulphates) do not behave the same as the cationics (the ones in conditioner). Maybe do as KathyMack has and analyse your products based on ingredients until you have a short list of possible culprits?

The curl booster is a liquidy lotion consistency so easy to spread, the bottle is a pump not a spray as it looks like. It definitely does something, even in fairly small amounts: less seems to be more which makes it more economical!
Firefox, you have told me before that the polyquat family is massive, and seeing that 4, 7 and 10 have caused problems, I figured I should give 37 and 72 (which are in the curl booster) at least give a chance. I just returned from grocery shopping and on my way home, I stopped at the Body Shop and bought the curl booster (for just €5,50 instead of €11!). Curious to see if I like it and how I respond to the polyquats.

I have used the search function on the forum as well this morning and so far, most people actually really like it. I intend to use it on wet hair, rub a tiny bit between my hands, then smooth it in, scrunch, plop. I know it's designed to be used with heat, but is it essential? I don't have a hair dryer, diffuser, whatsoever.
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F - LP - HD - NE
Fine, low porosity, high density, normal elasticity
Hairtype 2c

Low poo: Burt's Bees Very Volumizing Pomegranate Shampoo
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Old 07-20-2013, 07:30 AM   #35
 
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Firefox, you have told me before that the polyquat family is massive, and seeing that 4, 7 and 10 have caused problems, I figured I should give 37 and 72 (which are in the curl booster) at least give a chance. I just returned from grocery shopping and on my way home, I stopped at the Body Shop and bought the curl booster (for just €5,50 instead of €11!). Curious to see if I like it and how I respond to the polyquats.

I have used the search function on the forum as well this morning and so far, most people actually really like it. I intend to use it on wet hair, rub a tiny bit between my hands, then smooth it in, scrunch, plop. I know it's designed to be used with heat, but is it essential? I don't have a hair dryer, diffuser, whatsoever.
I didn't use it with heat, I only diffuse for a night/ day out and I wouldn't use this product for that, I can't imagine it has enough hold. But I've only used it a few times so no authority!!
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CO-wash: Inecto coconut
Treatments: Komaza Matani, coconut oil, Hairveda Sitrinillah
Leave in: Fructis Sleek & Shine (old), Gliss ultimate volume, Inecto argan
Styler: Umberto Giannini jelly, Boots Essentials gel
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Old 07-20-2013, 10:51 AM   #36
 
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I also didn't use it with heat...

I've used it with 2 different methods:
1) on dry second day hair to battle frizzies and give the impression of more definition: big success..
2) on wet hair, under gel (I haven't tried it on itself since it doesn't seem to have much hold and until now I only experimented with medium-hard hold...)

KCCC: I loooove the smell of it, and seem to really like the whole product as well... I have had less bad hair days since I'm using it, so yes I like it...

Things I want to experiment with on days that I don't care if my hair looks nice or not: (I never experiment on days when I DO care )
- only the curl boost
- FSG (I've been saying that for tooooo long, definitely have to do that one)
- Aloe Vera gel (have a bottle...)
- conditioner styling only

If the experiments don't work out well, I'll just make a bun

Firefox: I experimented with a new PT a couple of days ago, Mill Creek Biotin conditioner: seems nice and I like the peppermint in it ... it seems to... clean my scalp or something... it feels "fresh" (like when eating peppermint or rubbing eucalyptus on your chest when having a cold, that kind of freshness)
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Old 07-21-2013, 12:59 PM   #37
 
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the rainforest condish is my fav condish i really love that stuff. the shampoo to it is great as well. i use it as a leave in mixed with a bit of oil. its great, gives me the hold i need and moisture.
i live in germany and am on a collage budget, so i havent been able to buy it for months but i do love it and will next time i can.

i have tried the curlbooster, but i didnt think much of it. ive got a routine, very natural, with lots of oils and condish, bit of shampoo though not much other stuff. i might have to try it again though now i know more about my hair.
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Old 07-22-2013, 11:39 AM   #38
 
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Okay so I bought the curl boost last Saturday. These are my findings so far.

Saturday
Washing day! Did a low poo, followed by CJ Beauticurls Argan & Olive Oil as RO (I figured I need moisture but I ended up being slightly overconditioned... I just don't really like what AO GPB does for me anymore). Then I applied homemade FSG to soaking wet hair and plopped for an hour. Result: amazing hair, though a few curls were a bit fuzzy because of the overconditioning. That's why I misted my hair with some water, applied some of the curl boost (one pump) and a tiny bit of FSG to top it off. I didn't take pictures and I'm sorry I didn't because my hair looked absolutely gorgeous! One of the best hair days.

Sunday
Yesterday, I rewet my hair with the shower head, then applied two pumps of the curl boost stuff and topped it off with FSG. Results looked great when wet (though slightly frizzy) but it really weighed down my hair and it looked terrible in the evening. Barely any waves, fuzzy, dull, dry, and it felt really coated and greasy.

Monday
It's really warm here in the Netherlands so I put it up in a pony tail. I usually put it in the tail first, then wet what's hanging loose because that's the only way to make it work. I applied some curl boost and nothing else. I'm happy that my hair is soft instead of crunchy but I could've achieved the same without any product at all. My hair looks lifeless and where are the curls? It feels coated. I'm not happy at all.
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Low poo: Burt's Bees Very Volumizing Pomegranate Shampoo
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Old 07-22-2013, 11:43 AM   #39
 
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That would be waaaaaay too much product for me. For second day hair I almost never add product... I suppose I could add a little plain FSG but that's about it. Maybe another jelly type like SS CEJ or a light spray like SSI Vanilla Coconut... but even then my hair can get gunky w/ layers.
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fine - low porosity - medium density - normal elasticity. Very high dews. Soft water.

Cowash: CJ Daily Fix
Low-poo: CJ Gentle Cleansing Shampoo, Giovanni 2chic BK&AO
RO: TN Radiant Care, Giovanni SaS, Ogx BKT*, Sukin Nourishing, SS Caitlin's, various
LI: sometimes TN Radiant Care
Styler: FSG with CNPF, CJ Pattern Pusha, Volumax Mega, Ouidad Climate Control*, Ogx BKT serum*
PT: CJ Repair Me, IAgirl's gelatine

*have cones
underline = I love these!

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Old 07-22-2013, 12:48 PM   #40
 
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That would be waaaaaay too much product for me. For second day hair I almost never add product... I suppose I could add a little plain FSG but that's about it. Maybe another jelly type like SS CEJ or a light spray like SSI Vanilla Coconut... but even then my hair can get gunky w/ layers.
Wavydaze, it is way too much product for me as well. I didn't intend to use anything other than FSG on Saturday but as I had to boost it a bit because of the overconditioning, I figured I'd try my new stuff as well. I'd read that some people use the boost under FSG, so I tried that yesterday. Today just the boost. I know I'm sensitive to polyquats 4, 7 and 10 so I'm thinking that the polyquats might cause the problems in this case.

I'm curious about your routine though, wavydaze. Would you like to share them?
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Low poo: Burt's Bees Very Volumizing Pomegranate Shampoo
Protein: IAGirl's gelatine treatment
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Styling: KCCC

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