Go Back   CurlTalk > Hair > General Discussion about Curly Hair

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-03-2008, 07:40 AM   #1
 
Curly Girl Fla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,005
Default Natural Clarifiers other than Baking Soda?

I like to use baking soda in warm water to clarify once a week or every two weeks, especially since using bars to cleanse my hair. I was wondering what other natural alternatives people may be using- lemon juice or other citrus? Special herbs/tinctures? I just don't want to over dry my hair, although I haven't had any issues as of yet. I figured this may get more traffic than the all-natural forum, so I started here. Thanks
Curly Girl Fla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2008, 08:15 AM   #2
 
StruttsWife's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,005
Send a message via AIM to StruttsWife Send a message via Yahoo to StruttsWife
Default

Hey, girl!

Anything acid-based - such as lemon juice or ACV - won't clarify the hair. Baking soda is effective because it is alkaline and raises the cuticle of the hair shaft, but lemon juice and ACV are acidic ... therefore, sealing the hair cuticle shut. It is important, however, if you are going to clarify with baking soda or another alkaline substance, to follow it immediately with an acidic rinse to close everything back down, and then moisturize, moisturize, moisturize.

As far as what else besides baking soda can be used - I've heard of using "Alka Seltzer" tablets dissolved in warm water, but I can't tell you for sure if this is effective or damaging or anything like that.
__________________
- Tiffany
Hair Stylist and Curly Hair Specialist - St. Petersburg, FL (Tampa Bay)

Blog: Live Curly, Live Free
Facebook fan page: Live Curly Live Free

Sulfate- and non-water soluble silicone-free since 04/22/2002
3B, brunette: medium texture, low porosity, high density

StruttsWife is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2008, 08:30 AM   #3
 
ibraidhair's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Posts: 332
Default

Holy cow! I cannot imagine using baking soda every week! It's pretty harsh about stripping the hair. I think if my hair needed clarifying every week or 2, I'd find something else to cleanse it with. I'm curious about what "recipe" you're using though.

I think rhassoul clay is a good alternative. It also has good conditioning properties. I use it to clarify (especially my scalp area) every couple of months. And while I'm at it, I do mud packs on my face and shoulders, and mix a little salt with it for an awesome foot scrub. I love the stuff!
__________________
sarah
My Hair Blog
hair type: 3a-3b/M/iii
length: slightly past tailbone when pulled tight
normal routine: Nature's Gate shampoo (on scalp only), Suave Aloe conditioner, apple cider vinegar, raw shea butter, FOTE Aloe Vera Gel, TRESemme Curl Locking spray (occasionally).
other favorites: olive oil, rhassoul clay, honey
ibraidhair is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2008, 08:43 AM   #4
 
Curly Girl Fla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,005
Default

Hey, StruttsWife! Thanks for responding. Yeah, I was aware about the acidity closing the cuticle, but I'm just grasping at straws...I love the acv rinses after I cleanse, but I know that they won't prevent any natural buildup...

Ibraidhair-it really hasn't been bad for my hair at all, surprisingly enough. I do deep condition or oil after. But I want to be proactive for a change, and prevent damage from ocurring . I use a basic 1t (sometimes T for all my hair)/1c water, and read this info on a blog online a little while ago, which basically verified for me that I was doing it right:
Quote:
How do I go shampoo free?
Use one tablespoon of baking soda per one cup of warm or hot water. You can double or triple the recipe if you have very, very long or thick hair. But do not use more baking soda, your hair will become hard, dry or feel brittle if you use too much. You can put this mix in a recycled shampoo bottle, and apply to your hair with warm water.
The mix should not feel gritty, and should be a liquid. If you have very short or thick hair, you may find it easier to make a paste with a tablespoon of baking soda (or less) and sprinkle it over very wet hair and massage in. Otherwise, spray or pour the mixture onto your hair and work it in. Let it sit about a minute, and then rinse. I personally find it easiest to make a liquidy paste in the palm of my hand with about half a tablespoon, and then sprinkle and massage into dripping wet hair. I have very short hair, so I use less. Experiment and see what works best for you, there are no official rules. For a typical rinse, make up a solution of one to two tablespoons of Apple Cider Vinegar (ACV) per cup of water. Apply to wet hair, massage into scalp and rinse off with cold water. Please note, you don't always have to apply a rinse with every wash! I personally find I only need to do a rinse every 2-3 washes.
Curly Girl Fla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2008, 09:30 AM   #5
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 380
Default natural clarifiers other than baking soda

Yikes! I tried baking soda once, quite awhile ago when I didn't have any clarifying shampoo, and never again! It dried out my hair SO-O badly, even with applying moisturizing conditioner afterwards that it took several go-rounds with regular moisturizing shampoo and conditioner to get my hair back to the way it was before this episode. Recently, I was seriously thinking of going CG after seeing the great pix here of people who did, but now that I see that baking soda is part of the deal, I'm truly chicken about this, as well as having to put up with awful-looking hair for several weeks(I do sort of have to look good around here, even though I don't work at a public office.)
__________________
health-conscious, visionary artist in transition
cara4curls is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2008, 11:20 AM   #6
 
lizyoung's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 44
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cara4curls View Post
Recently, I was seriously thinking of going CG after seeing the great pix here of people who did, but now that I see that baking soda is part of the deal, I'm truly chicken about this
I have just started CG again (when I did it last time I never used baking soda) so I don't think it is necessary. You might consider doing a modified CG and just do super low-poo every once in a while.
__________________
2c/3b ii CG since 27.08.08
Using:
Aubrey Organics Honeysuckle Rose or Trader Joe's Nourish condish; Kiss My Face Upper Management Styling gel
Drying: with microfibre waffle weave dish towels from Walmart and a diffuser when I feel like it
Contemplating: trying a curl cream
lizyoung is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2008, 11:52 AM   #7
 
QuirkyYogini's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 562
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by StruttsWife View Post
Hey, girl!

Anything acid-based - such as lemon juice or ACV - won't clarify the hair. Baking soda is effective because it is alkaline and raises the cuticle of the hair shaft, but lemon juice and ACV are acidic ... therefore, sealing the hair cuticle shut. It is important, however, if you are going to clarify with baking soda or another alkaline substance, to follow it immediately with an acidic rinse to close everything back down, and then moisturize, moisturize, moisturize.

As far as what else besides baking soda can be used - I've heard of using "Alka Seltzer" tablets dissolved in warm water, but I can't tell you for sure if this is effective or damaging or anything like that.
This makes sense, but shouldn't you moisturize before you do the ACV rinse? That way, you know the moisture gets in, and you seal it in with the acidic rinse? I thought that is why you let conditioner sit in your hair for a while. It takes a while of the conditioner to sink in, so if your cuticles are already raised it makes it easier for you. No?
__________________
I have 3c hair that I haven't straightened in over 5 years. It's just past shoulder length when dry, and almost waist length when pulled straight.

Products:
9/02/08 Went CG
05/12/09 Still CG. Cowashing with VO5 Lavender Luster. I then condition with Giovanni Smooth as Silk. Styling with VO5 Lavender Luster conditioner with my wide-toothed comb.

http://public.fotki.com/QuirkyYogini/



QuirkyYogini is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2008, 12:17 PM   #8
 
BotticelliBabe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,562
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cara4curls View Post
Yikes! I tried baking soda once, quite awhile ago when I didn't have any clarifying shampoo, and never again! It dried out my hair SO-O badly, even with applying moisturizing conditioner afterwards that it took several go-rounds with regular moisturizing shampoo and conditioner to get my hair back to the way it was before this episode. Recently, I was seriously thinking of going CG after seeing the great pix here of people who did, but now that I see that baking soda is part of the deal, I'm truly chicken about this, as well as having to put up with awful-looking hair for several weeks(I do sort of have to look good around here, even though I don't work at a public office.)
I see two big problems with what you did the first time that most likely led to your intense dislike of baking soda for your hair.

First, you didn't seal the cuticle back down with anything acidic after using an alkaline treatment, and leaving your cuticles wide open like that will cause you enough problems by itself. But add to it that, second, you used "regular moisturizing shampoo" (with sulfates, yes?) with the cuticles still wide open, and you're only compounding and exacerbating the situation, and adding to the strawlike texture and extreme dryness and frizziness. Besides - I think that moisturizing shampoo might be an oxymoron, but that's just my opinion.

If you use baking soda or sulfates, both of them will raise the cuticle, like louvre shades opening. You have to use something to seal them back down (or close the shades), and vinegar, cold water, or citrus fruit juice (lemon or lime, most commonly) will do that. You just can't use an alkaline treatment and not use an acid to seal it all back down, or you'll get dryness, strawlike texture, plus frizzies and tangles.

All that said, baking soda isn't "part of the deal" when it comes to CG - I did it for six months and never used baking soda. I eventually had to go back to sulfate poo because I needed a cone to help with my terrible tangling in the back, but that had nothing to do with baking soda. Even now that I use a sulfate poo though, I still do a honey & vinegar cool water rinse after every wash.
__________________
BB


http://www.BotticelliBotanicals.etsy.com
BSL/Mid Back, thick 3a/b

Botticelli Botanicals Meringue
Botticelli Botanicals Smoothie
Botticelli Botanicals Styling Mudd w/ double avocado oil and double agave
Botticelli Botanicals Lime in the Coconut Butter

Last edited by BotticelliBabe; 09-03-2008 at 12:20 PM.
BotticelliBabe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 05:28 AM   #9
 
StruttsWife's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,005
Send a message via AIM to StruttsWife Send a message via Yahoo to StruttsWife
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by QuirkyYogini View Post
This makes sense, but shouldn't you moisturize before you do the ACV rinse? That way, you know the moisture gets in, and you seal it in with the acidic rinse? I thought that is why you let conditioner sit in your hair for a while. It takes a while of the conditioner to sink in, so if your cuticles are already raised it makes it easier for you. No?
You may get a little bit of benefit if your hair is particularly dry, but I always understood the acid from the ACV/lemon juice rinse would penetrate into the cortex before the cuticle shut down and negate some of that benefit before the cuticle closes, if that makes any sense.
__________________
- Tiffany
Hair Stylist and Curly Hair Specialist - St. Petersburg, FL (Tampa Bay)

Blog: Live Curly, Live Free
Facebook fan page: Live Curly Live Free

Sulfate- and non-water soluble silicone-free since 04/22/2002
3B, brunette: medium texture, low porosity, high density

StruttsWife is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 07:54 AM   #10
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 1,309
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cara4curls View Post
Yikes! I tried baking soda once, quite awhile ago when I didn't have any clarifying shampoo, and never again! It dried out my hair SO-O badly, even with applying moisturizing conditioner afterwards that it took several go-rounds with regular moisturizing shampoo and conditioner to get my hair back to the way it was before this episode. Recently, I was seriously thinking of going CG after seeing the great pix here of people who did, but now that I see that baking soda is part of the deal, I'm truly chicken about this, as well as having to put up with awful-looking hair for several weeks(I do sort of have to look good around here, even though I don't work at a public office.)
You do not HAVE to use baking soda to be CG!
__________________
"Well I love that dirty water. Oh, Boston, you're my home!"
newcurly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 08:41 AM   #11
 
Curly Girl Fla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,005
Default

I did a BS wash last night, rinsed some conditioner through, then did a good ACV rinse...then did an overnight DT with a hairmask I have...my hair feels really good now...I like using BS once in awhile, but I definitely need the ACV and moisture treatment. I suppose I'll stick with this method of clarifying, and maybe try some clay/mud cleansing periodically...
Curly Girl Fla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 09:33 AM   #12
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,718
Default

okay, now I'm confused. I have been co-washing, and then acv rinsing, following with a more moisturizing conditioner. My question is am I getting any benefit from that? Or should I baking soda wash, rinse, acv rinse, then condition when I need to give my hair that pick me up and remove residue, etc? Thanks!
__________________
http://public.fotki.com/TLGuerrero/

password: curly

3B w/3A underneath

Medium texture
Average porosity

Crazy-picky hair; likes some oils and proteins, but not others, can tolerate some glycerin.

Current products-
Co-wash: Suave/Vo5/TJ Refresh
Rinse out & Leave in: Suave Tropical Coconut/Garnier Triple Nutrition
Gel: Herbal Essences Set Me Up/Aussie Tizz No Frizz
marinacurlz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 10:13 AM   #13
 
Wiggilyhair's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,164
Default

I've ben following this thread and I'm confused too.
Does this mean that after using a clarifying shampoo (I like Vo5 Lime Clarifying) that I should be doing an ACV rinse right after using it? Wouldn't that be too harsh?
Wiggilyhair is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 10:24 AM   #14
 
TooSense's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 229
Default

Wow! Something as simple as clarifying should not be so complicated!

I clarify w/a sulfate shampoo every week or two. It's a laureth sulfate so I'm going on the assumption that it's not so bad (and if I'm wrong please don't correct me ). Specifically, Nexxus Aloe Rid, which claims to be a gentle clarifier.

Out of curiosity, is baking soda less harsh on the hair than sulfates? If no, why bother with it?
TooSense is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 03:18 PM   #15
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 323
Default

I think Curly Girl Fla was wanting to know if alternatives to baking soda exist; the baking soda is a natural way to eliminate the buildup from washing with soap/shampoo bars.
ajane is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 04:28 PM   #16
 
curlyjenn10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,025
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TooSense View Post
Wow! Something as simple as clarifying should not be so complicated!

I clarify w/a sulfate shampoo every week or two. It's a laureth sulfate so I'm going on the assumption that it's not so bad (and if I'm wrong please don't correct me ). Specifically, Nexxus Aloe Rid, which claims to be a gentle clarifier.

Out of curiosity, is baking soda less harsh on the hair than sulfates? If no, why bother with it?
Yes, baking soda is less harsh than sulfates.
__________________
CG since 6/15/08!
Medium-Fine/Normal Porosity

http://collegecurly.blogspot.com/
curlyjenn10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 11:02 PM   #17
 
BotticelliBabe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,562
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggilyhair View Post
I've ben following this thread and I'm confused too.
Does this mean that after using a clarifying shampoo (I like Vo5 Lime Clarifying) that I should be doing an ACV rinse right after using it? Wouldn't that be too harsh?
Wiggilyhair, that's what I do, and it's not drying or harsh at all. In fact, I sulfate poo just as often as I used to, but using the vinegar & honey rinse before getting out of the shower has really made a huge difference. I can't believe how detangling it is, too.
__________________
BB


http://www.BotticelliBotanicals.etsy.com
BSL/Mid Back, thick 3a/b

Botticelli Botanicals Meringue
Botticelli Botanicals Smoothie
Botticelli Botanicals Styling Mudd w/ double avocado oil and double agave
Botticelli Botanicals Lime in the Coconut Butter
BotticelliBabe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2008, 10:15 AM   #18
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 127
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BotticelliBabe View Post
Wiggilyhair, that's what I do, and it's not drying or harsh at all. In fact, I sulfate poo just as often as I used to, but using the vinegar & honey rinse before getting out of the shower has really made a huge difference. I can't believe how detangling it is, too.
BotticelliBabe - I'm confused too. But your results are so wonderful, would you mind describing your routine with the baking soda, ACV and honey? Thanks.
curlygirl81 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2008, 10:20 AM   #19
 
Curly Girl Fla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,005
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ajane View Post
I think Curly Girl Fla was wanting to know if alternatives to baking soda exist; the baking soda is a natural way to eliminate the buildup from washing with soap/shampoo bars.
Yup-that's all I wanted to know
But it's great to see how others do their clarifying. I personally don't have a problem with BS-it does dry, but not horribly so, and I definitely am a proponent of ACV/HONEY rinses! I never get dried out from acv, and it should be fine if diluted enough. I don't use conditioner because of the rinses, I think. As BotticelliBabe says, they detangle and smooth like a dream....
Curly Girl Fla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2008, 10:34 AM   #20
 
BotticelliBabe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,562
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by curlygirl81 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by BotticelliBabe View Post
Wiggilyhair, that's what I do, and it's not drying or harsh at all. In fact, I sulfate poo just as often as I used to, but using the vinegar & honey rinse before getting out of the shower has really made a huge difference. I can't believe how detangling it is, too.
BotticelliBabe - I'm confused too. But your results are so wonderful, would you mind describing your routine with the baking soda, ACV and honey? Thanks.
In all honesty, I have never used a BS wash/rinse - just white vinegar and honey (not even ACV). Plus, I'm not CG anymore, so I don't know if my routine would help you - I sulfate poo and use cones. If you want though, I could go find the thread where I posted my entire routine for somebody else...although I'll warn you now - it's a HUGE post. *lol*
__________________
BB


http://www.BotticelliBotanicals.etsy.com
BSL/Mid Back, thick 3a/b

Botticelli Botanicals Meringue
Botticelli Botanicals Smoothie
Botticelli Botanicals Styling Mudd w/ double avocado oil and double agave
Botticelli Botanicals Lime in the Coconut Butter
BotticelliBabe is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes



Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:35 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2011 NaturallyCurly.com