A white woman is the only love interest in new movie "Red Tails (Tuskegee Airmen)"

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If I was writing the screenplay for a war movie, I might not include scenes of the wives either, as that might detract from the main focus. The first act of a movie should start from a point that is relevant to the story. If the characters spend all their time away from their homes and the conflict doesn't relate to their families, then that side of their lives that isn't relevant to the story. Too many movies nowadays start with unnecessary background information because it is thought this will make characters more well rounded, but you should learn about the characters by the way they act and react as the story progresses. Think of 12 Angry Men. You don't meet the characters until they are already in the jury room, but their personalities emerge once they start clashing over their opinions.

I agree that women, BW especially, need to be better depicted on screen (12 Angry Men is a good example of a movie that is mysteriously deprived of any female characters) but a war movie in a time women didn't enlist doesn't seem like the right medium to promote gender equality. A movie like this could at best only provide very brief and fleeting scenes of BW and that's hardly satisfying.
Originally Posted by Dedachan
quoted for emphasis
Every war movie *except* those with black soldiers show the soldiers fighting to come home to their women (of the same race). This is true for every white war movie from the black and white era, to "Saving Private Ryan" and right on down to "The Dirty Dozen." When it comes to black soldiers, movie makers find ingenious ways of leaving black women out! This trend even touched "A Soldier's Story." I'm sure just as many and more IR happened with white soldiers, but guess what? Those are rarely-if-ever put front and center, if they even get shown at all, in hero movies with majority white casts.
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Well George Lucas can't be to much for erasing black women cause he's been with Mellody Hobson, the president of Ariel Investments since 2006. And there is no mistaking that she's definitely black. Lucas orginally wanted Samuel L. Jackson (a black man) to direct the film and act in it. Jackson is married to his black wife (LaTanya Richardson Jackson) of 32 years. But Jackson wouldn't commit to doing the film so Lucas had to move on.

Here's Lucas with his signficant other...





Lucas has made it known that he had an incredibly difficult time even getting studios to market and or finance a film starring an all black cast (which tells me Lucas probably wanted black women in it) without any whites playing major roles in the film. And that's why it took him so long to get it out there. He said that the majority of the profits comes from overseas and studios feel like there really is no market there for an all black film..so they weren't willing to take the risk. So to get the film made Lucas probably had to wheel and deal to do what he had to do to get it out there..after all the story is about the Tuskegee Airmen..it's NOT about their relationship with their wives/girlfriends. And that meant it couldn't just be all blacks in the film in major roles so they probably stuck a white woman in there for good measure. Lucas has DEFINITELY gone on record about how Hollywood will not support black films. So this situation is NOT his fault. And would you believe he actually put $58 million dollars OF HIS OWN MONEY into ensuring that this film got made. Well he did! Not only that to make sure it gets distributed he's adding another $35 million to that..so I while I definitely think it's unfortunate that black films aren't considered worth it to studios and black actors are often not given a fair chance...I don't think George Lucas' reputation should be tarnished as if HE has some issue with blacks getting their due. Cause he's tried and put his money where his mouth is as well.

BBC News - George Lucas says Hollywood won't support black films?

Last edited by *Marah*; 01-16-2012 at 10:30 PM.
I will give Lucas some respect for finally makin a movie about the Tuskegee air men which I believe is long over due. We can't say what he'a motive was in not including black women in his movie. We just can't say. So therefore I won't say i wouldn't watch the movie. And for him being married to a black women, And being certain him and his wife have discussed race relations. It just seems a lil extreme to boycott a movie that brings positive light to the sacrifice that black men have made in American history
This is a "remake". Its been done b4.,just not mainstream
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Yea, one that main stream 😊, so it's a good thing, a very good thing
I think its worth mentioning that we spend a lot of time trying to mainstream into hollywood when we need more Blacks, hell more Americans, in science & math, especially females. We are too busy chasing fame & glory through the entertainment industry. Jmo. The tuskeegee airmen were not mainstream actors. We need to stop playing useful ppl on the tv & big screen and be instrumental in advancing something that impacts society for the better.
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I think its worth mentioning that we spend a lot of time trying to mainstream into hollywood when we need more Blacks, hell more Americans, in science & math, especially females. We are too busy chasing fame & glory through the entertainment industry. Jmo. The tuskeegee airmen were not mainstream actors. We need to stop playing useful ppl on the tv & big screen and be instrumental in advancing something that impacts society for the better.
Originally Posted by sienna40

I'm an actor. It is my chosen profession and my passion. There is nothing wrong that.


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I have a special place in my heart for our military men and women. And that's why I say it's a good thing to pay focus on the Tuskegee air men whether or not the movie has black women in it. I don't think the focus is to be on that per say. They gave they're lives when they didn't have to and on top of that, they put up with racism. The focus is on they're efforts and sacrifices for us as a people. I'll givem that
I will give Lucas some respect for finally makin a movie about the Tuskegee air men which I believe is long over due. We can't say what he'a motive was in not including black women in his movie. We just can't say. So therefore I won't say i wouldn't watch the movie. And for him being married to a black women, And being certain him and his wife have discussed race relations. It just seems a lil extreme to boycott a movie that brings positive light to the sacrifice that black men have made in American history
Originally Posted by Nikki3b
Lucas is not stupid..he understands that serious black films are indeed a risk when making because the profits often don't come back in stellar numbers that big studios are looking to earn. I feel like instead of dogging out George Lucas, the screen writers, and the actors that are married to white women (which give me a break that has nothing to do with the film)..that I can just appreciate the fact that Lucas cared enough to get this story out there despite being scoffed at and turned away. Because frankly, Lucas is an extremely rich white man with not only white privilege but celebrity privilege. In the big scheme of things a story that seems basically positive about black men (that may very well lose him money in the long run) doing something besides acting degenerate didn't have to be a priority for a guy like him.

BTW, He's not married to Mellody Hobson..they have just been a couple for a number of years now. She's never been married and has no children. But still, they probably have discussed race at some point like you said.
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I'll probably go see it.

1. It's George Lucas.
2. I'm retired military. Military movies interest me.

I'll have to withhold judgment on the rest for after I see it.


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I was going to comment on this, but I just glanced over at my Irish husband and half Irish baby, and I forgot what I was about to say.

Love you guys. Hope the conversation remains productive. I'm off to eat!
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I think its worth mentioning that we spend a lot of time trying to mainstream into hollywood when we need more Blacks, hell more Americans, in science & math, especially females. We are too busy chasing fame & glory through the entertainment industry. Jmo. The tuskeegee airmen were not mainstream actors. We need to stop playing useful ppl on the tv & big screen and be instrumental in advancing something that impacts society for the better.
Originally Posted by sienna40

I'm an actor. It is my chosen profession and my passion. There is nothing wrong that.
Originally Posted by Trenell
Yeah, I "hear" what you are saying Sienna..but what does one really have to do with the other ? The fact that blacks want to act or be entertainers has nothing to do with there being a lack of blacks being instrumental in advancements that impact society for the better. Furthermore, acting and entertaining can impact society for the better. Depends on what it is..and how it's done.

And I'd like to point out that contrary to popular belief that there are PLENTY of blacks doing just that creating, helping with, inventing, and coming up with excellent advancements to better society..but you don't hear about them. For instance: Jerry Lawson, Scott Williams, Valerie Thomas, Sylvester James Gates, James A. Harris, Rick Kittles, Dr. Patricia Bath, George Alcorn. Just to name a small few but I could give you TONS more of current black inventors, scientists, and mathematicians, and or professors that have contributed tremendously to society for the better..and I'm not talking about folks as old as George Washington Carver..I'm talking about modern blacks.

So blacks are contributing and in BIG ways. They just don't get that vast and public recognition and it's unfortunate that you as a person of color don't seem to recognize those facts. Maybe YOU need to do some more research and stop listening to the rhetoric about what blacks DON'T contribute to society. Because blacks have always contributed to the betterment of American society when they had an opportunity and continue to do so. This country (USA) was built on the backs of blacks..and many of them had their inventions and patents stolen from them by whites that have bettered this country.

Last edited by *Marah*; 01-17-2012 at 12:02 AM.
Also, along the lines of under recognized WWII personnel, I'd love to see a story about the women who test piloted those planes to free up men for combat.


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don't forget The Affair with foine, foine, foine courtney vance! a black WWII soldier falling in love with a married white wife of another soldier.

i looooooove that movie. i cry at the ending. if you haven't seen it and you love period pieces, like i do, please watch it.

to the OP, i totally get your point. and it's valid. it is more than a coincidence that this happens in movies. and as someone mentioned, it's probably because a black-on-black love story probably wouldn't attract the larger audience that these movies are targeting. don't think these decisions are never about $$$.
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I don't know about what percentage of contempary movies depict the wives and frankly I think it's irrelevant if that's the current trend because all it would mean is movies are lacking in originality. Good Morning Vietnam, The Great Escape, Full Metal Jacket all start after the soldiers/recruits have already left their homes. Good Morning Vietnam also has Robin Williams fall for a Vietnamese woman, so a similar structure to the movie in question. A love story based on an already existing relationship would be tricky in this scenario, since the soldiers are away from home for the entire duration of the movie. They could have left the romance out too, but that's another issue. Adding a love interest to a story that doesn't really need one is just Hollywood being Hollywood.

I'm not insensitive to the need to show more women, more black people and, do the math, more black women on screen. And I disagree that it's not important to have minorities represented on screen. The media has a huge influence on how we perceive others and those who control the media have the power to dismantle stereotypes (if only they would use it!).

But I don't think we can judge a movie before we've seen it and try to impose what it should or shouldn't be before we try to understand what their angle is. Using other movies as a standard is just pointless. Artists should innovate and break away from convention rather than copy what has already been done.

Geeky, it crossed my mind that women might have been left out of 12 Angry Men for historical reasons after I posted last night. That and 12 Angry People doesn't have the same ring. Still there are many movies that barely feature women or where the women are merely ornamental and they don't have the same excuse.
I dont think this should come as a shock to people anymore. Its the way it is in hollywood. danny glover has been trying to get a movie about nat turner made for years. There's movies about black people, but stars white people. its the way it's going to be until people (black and white) get better taste in movies.

I love spike lee movies, but if you notice his biggest hit was the inside man. the color purple was brillant and I still feel it was robbed at the oscars due to the black cast.
Ninjarette and Obsidian Doll like this.
I dont think this should come as a shock to people anymore. Its the way it is in hollywood. danny glover has been trying to get a movie about nat turner made for years. There's movies about black people, but stars white people. its the way it's going to be until people (black and white) get better taste in movies.

I love spike lee movies, but if you notice his biggest hit was the inside man. the color purple was brillant and I still feel it was robbed at the oscars due to the black cast.
Originally Posted by thelio
...and I understand what the OP was really getting at. I get so tired of not seeing healthy, strong, committed relationships BETWEEN black people on the BIG screen (and television). Nothing wrong with interracial relationships...I've been in a few myself. I'm equal opportunity. But I'm not going to just brush off what the OP wrote, because I think there's some deeper stuff there (and I could be wrong).

When we do see black men and women on screen together, the relationships are often profoundly dysfunctional. Black women are often missing partners period - we're portrayed as overly strong, bossy and matriarchal. If there's a handsome, intelligent black man on board, they'll often opt to pair him with anybody other than a black woman. You still hardly ever see white/non-black men with black women...unless the black women are racially ambiguous. We're making progress on television, thank God. We still have a long way to go. Gabrielle Union and John Cho was a BIG deal. Yep.

No, the movie isn't about the wives and women of the airmen. But we all know that our intimate relationships have a strong impact on who we are/who we become. So yeah, they chose to leave black women out, but chose to stick a random white woman in there, for what exactly? They had to put that in there. I know exactly where Nashville77 is coming from.

I knew her words, along with the pics of the black actors with white wives/women, wouldn't go over well. But I'm not going to shoot down what she said. I don't think it's necessary to boycott the movie, because I don't think we should look to Hollywood to validate us (black people). That's not on the agenda, and it never has been . We got other business to attend to. I plan to see the movie.
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Last edited by Ninjarette; 01-17-2012 at 10:33 AM.
don't forget The Affair with foine, foine, foine courtney vance! a black WWII soldier falling in love with a married white wife of another soldier.

i looooooove that movie. i cry at the ending. if you haven't seen it and you love period pieces, like i do, please watch it.

to the OP, i totally get your point. and it's valid. it is more than a coincidence that this happens in movies. and as someone mentioned, it's probably because a black-on-black love story probably wouldn't attract the larger audience that these movies are targeting. don't think these decisions are never about $$$.
Originally Posted by rainshower
I loved The Affair!
I think its worth mentioning that we spend a lot of time trying to mainstream into hollywood when we need more Blacks, hell more Americans, in science & math, especially females. We are too busy chasing fame & glory through the entertainment industry. Jmo. The tuskeegee airmen were not mainstream actors. We need to stop playing useful ppl on the tv & big screen and be instrumental in advancing something that impacts society for the better.
Originally Posted by sienna40

I'm an actor. It is my chosen profession and my passion. There is nothing wrong that.
Originally Posted by Trenell
Yeah, I "hear" what you are saying Sienna..but what does one really have to do with the other ? The fact that blacks want to act or be entertainers has nothing to do with there being a lack of blacks being instrumental in advancements that impact society for the better. Furthermore, acting and entertaining can impact society for the better. Depends on what it is..and how it's done.

And I'd like to point out that contrary to popular belief that there are PLENTY of blacks doing just that creating, helping with, inventing, and coming up with excellent advancements to better society..but you don't hear about them. For instance: Jerry Lawson, Scott Williams, Valerie Thomas, Sylvester James Gates, James A. Harris, Rick Kittles, Dr. Patricia Bath, George Alcorn. Just to name a small few but I could give you TONS more of current black inventors, scientists, and mathematicians, and or professors that have contributed tremendously to society for the better..and I'm not talking about folks as old as George Washington Carver..I'm talking about modern blacks.

So blacks are contributing and in BIG ways. They just don't get that vast and public recognition and it's unfortunate that you as a person of color don't seem to recognize those facts. Maybe YOU need to do some more research and stop listening to the rhetoric about what blacks DON'T contribute to society. Because blacks have always contributed to the betterment of American society when they had an opportunity and continue to do so. This country (USA) was built on the backs of blacks..and many of them had their inventions and patents stolen from them by whites that have bettered this country.
Originally Posted by *Marah*
I'm married to a scientist so for me its not rhetoric. Its reality and its bleak where I am. Trust me we are not around in the numbers we need to be. How many black ppl know that grad school is practically free for those in science? Not many. My whole family was ignorant to that little tidbit along with many other ppl I know.

I'm not saying we can't impact positively via entertainment. We have in the past. But, there are other tangible careers our ppl don' seem to believe they can pursue.

Trenell, I apologize if I offended you that wasn' my intention. I also believe that if one wants to be an entertainer they should be educated in their craft. A lot of folks want to take the easy way and be "discovered" not go to peeforming arts schools, conservatories, etc.

I really think there is a lack of blacks in science and math. Even on tv. We are doing the voice over on the science channel but we aren't doing tge science.

Completely off topic. Sorry.
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I'm an actor. It is my chosen profession and my passion. There is nothing wrong that.
Originally Posted by Trenell
Yeah, I "hear" what you are saying Sienna..but what does one really have to do with the other ? The fact that blacks want to act or be entertainers has nothing to do with there being a lack of blacks being instrumental in advancements that impact society for the better. Furthermore, acting and entertaining can impact society for the better. Depends on what it is..and how it's done.

And I'd like to point out that contrary to popular belief that there are PLENTY of blacks doing just that creating, helping with, inventing, and coming up with excellent advancements to better society..but you don't hear about them. For instance: Jerry Lawson, Scott Williams, Valerie Thomas, Sylvester James Gates, James A. Harris, Rick Kittles, Dr. Patricia Bath, George Alcorn. Just to name a small few but I could give you TONS more of current black inventors, scientists, and mathematicians, and or professors that have contributed tremendously to society for the better..and I'm not talking about folks as old as George Washington Carver..I'm talking about modern blacks.

So blacks are contributing and in BIG ways. They just don't get that vast and public recognition and it's unfortunate that you as a person of color don't seem to recognize those facts. Maybe YOU need to do some more research and stop listening to the rhetoric about what blacks DON'T contribute to society. Because blacks have always contributed to the betterment of American society when they had an opportunity and continue to do so. This country (USA) was built on the backs of blacks..and many of them had their inventions and patents stolen from them by whites that have bettered this country.
Originally Posted by *Marah*
I'm married to a scientist so for me its not rhetoric. Its reality and its bleak where I am. Trust me we are not around in the numbers we need to be. How many black ppl know that grad school is practically free for those in science? Not many. My whole family was ignorant to that little tidbit along with many other ppl I know.

I'm not saying we can't impact positively via entertainment. We have in the past. But, there are other tangible careers our ppl don' seem to believe they can pursue.

Trenell, I apologize if I offended you that wasn' my intention. I also believe that if one wants to be an entertainer they should be educated in their craft. A lot of folks want to take the easy way and be "discovered" not go to peeforming arts schools, conservatories, etc.

I really think there is a lack of blacks in science and math. Even on tv. We are doing the voice over on the science channel but we aren't doing tge science.

Completely off topic. Sorry.
Originally Posted by sienna40
I agree regarding more blacks in science and math. I have trying to push (gently) into a more science or math oriented major. She has an absolute fear of math, due to a teacher who harshly criticized in fourth grade about a math score on a test. She acquaints science with having good math skills, so she is shying away from that field. The world would be her oyster if she could get past her phobia. Any suggestions?

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