President Obama supports same sex marriage

Like Tree75Likes

Hmmm... I don't think it was a crafted decision. Joe Biden gave his opinion and people started asking questions about Obama. Obama felt pressured to give an answer. I always thought he supported civil unions, but not gay marriage.

Like I said, I admire him for standing up for his values, but it will hurt. Though I think my gen is a more liberal, a lot of young people have left my state. Blue areas like Cleveland have lost whole districts while the more conservative suburbs have been hit but not as bad. I'm a Democrat in a moderate state, and I don't support gay marriage. I waffled on saying this because I know it's not a popular view here, but it's against my religious values and not something I can in good faith support. I don't however support my state's ban and I support civil unions. I also don't vote for President based on social issues but I will say it's becoming tough to reconcile being both a Catholic and a Democrat. I feel pulled in all directions.
Yes, voicing his support was a calculated move done to help increase his support among his base, which is not the religious, middle-of-the-road, conservative voters, but his young and left-wing voters. Polls say that he has lost some support among these voters and that his strategists are having him focus on "symbolic" issues to win them over that won't call for him having to actually create any legislation.

From here: https://www.commondreams.org/view/2012/04/18-7

I do think it would be abominable for a president not to voice support for marriage equality or to support but remain silent about it. However, he's not going to do anything about this. It's actually rather safe for him to say he supports this as it's an issue decided on the state level, not one under his jurisdiction anyway.
Formerly Urbancurl.
Medium-high density, fine-medium, low-normal porosity, 3b/c, permanent color.
CG, no heat, combs, brushes, parabens.
Fall/Winter HG=Alba Botanica Soft Hold Style Cream.
Spring/Summer HG=MGA Sculpting Gel
Current fave LI=Madre Labs Made by Nature for Baby Conditioner.
Limit oils, butters, glycerin.
Also, despite what people have noticed amongst their social circles, the research shows that the younger people are, the more likely they support marriage equality.

New analysis from the Pew Research Center shows how support for marriage equality is growing among all age groups, but the younger people are, the more likely they are to show support. About 59 percent of millennials favor legalizing same-sex marriage over just 33 percent of Silents.
(Silents were born between 19251945.)

Millennial Generation 26 Percent More Likely To Support Marriage Than 'Silent' Generation | ThinkProgress
Formerly Urbancurl.
Medium-high density, fine-medium, low-normal porosity, 3b/c, permanent color.
CG, no heat, combs, brushes, parabens.
Fall/Winter HG=Alba Botanica Soft Hold Style Cream.
Spring/Summer HG=MGA Sculpting Gel
Current fave LI=Madre Labs Made by Nature for Baby Conditioner.
Limit oils, butters, glycerin.
Yes, voicing his support was a calculated move done to help increase his support among his base, which is not the religious, middle-of-the-road, conservative voters, but his young and left-wing voters. Polls say that he has lost some support among these voters and that his strategists are having him focus on "symbolic" issues to win them over that won't call for him having to actually create any legislation.

From here: https://www.commondreams.org/view/2012/04/18-7

I do think it would be abominable for a president not to voice support for marriage equality or to support but remain silent about it. However, he's not going to do anything about this. It's actually rather safe for him to say he supports this as it's an issue decided on the state level, not one under his jurisdiction anyway.
Originally Posted by diaspora
Got to say I can't believe that's true, but if it is, it means Team Obama is in major danger. He absolutely can't afford to lose anyone in his base. At the same time I'm sorry but Obama can't afford for more than a second of his time to go to keeping young and left-wing voters. If he doesn't already have them he's already screwed. It's all about moving to the middle if he wants to win and gay marriage is waaay more than a symbolic issue for the middle.
Yes, voicing his support was a calculated move done to help increase his support among his base, which is not the religious, middle-of-the-road, conservative voters, but his young and left-wing voters. Polls say that he has lost some support among these voters and that his strategists are having him focus on "symbolic" issues to win them over that won't call for him having to actually create any legislation.

From here: https://www.commondreams.org/view/2012/04/18-7

I do think it would be abominable for a president not to voice support for marriage equality or to support but remain silent about it. However, he's not going to do anything about this. It's actually rather safe for him to say he supports this as it's an issue decided on the state level, not one under his jurisdiction anyway.
Originally Posted by diaspora
Got to say I can't believe that's true, but if it is, it means Team Obama is in major danger. He absolutely can't afford to lose anyone in his base. At the same time I'm sorry but Obama can't afford for more than a second of his time to go to keeping young and left-wing voters. If he doesn't already have them he's already screwed. It's all about moving to the middle if he wants to win and gay marriage is waaay more than a symbolic issue for the middle.
Originally Posted by NorahBugg
... I ...

Okay, the people for whom gay marriage is more than a symbolic issue are those of us who might want to get one someday.

For him to abandon us in order to win reelection would be an awful move and I think I might even be more upset to think that was happening than to see Romney win. If we've got a Democrat as a President who won't do anything differently than any given Republican because he's trying to appease Congress and the electorate, what's the point?

Statistics have shown that support for marriage equality is increasing, rapidly and dramatically. Even if he loses in November, ultimately, that's where we're clearly headed, and he is doing the right thing by standing on the side of equality.
2a/b (really thick but sort of fine with pretty weak waves), medium-to-fine texture, normal porosity (I think). Doesn't seem to like protein.

Favorite products: Kinky-Curly Knot Today, Kinky-Curly Curling Custard, Curl Junkie Curls in a Bottle, Curl Junkie Curl Rehab, Curl Junkie Curl Assurance Smoothing Lotion, Shea Moisture Curl and Style Milk, homemade flaxseed gel.

Still looking for a cleanser I like.

Last edited by amandamarie; 05-10-2012 at 01:30 PM. Reason: Removed a paragraph that got a little personal.
Yes, voicing his support was a calculated move done to help increase his support among his base, which is not the religious, middle-of-the-road, conservative voters, but his young and left-wing voters. Polls say that he has lost some support among these voters and that his strategists are having him focus on "symbolic" issues to win them over that won't call for him having to actually create any legislation.

From here: https://www.commondreams.org/view/2012/04/18-7

I do think it would be abominable for a president not to voice support for marriage equality or to support but remain silent about it. However, he's not going to do anything about this. It's actually rather safe for him to say he supports this as it's an issue decided on the state level, not one under his jurisdiction anyway.
Originally Posted by diaspora
Got to say I can't believe that's true, but if it is, it means Team Obama is in major danger. He absolutely can't afford to lose anyone in his base. At the same time I'm sorry but Obama can't afford for more than a second of his time to go to keeping young and left-wing voters. If he doesn't already have them he's already screwed. It's all about moving to the middle if he wants to win and gay marriage is waaay more than a symbolic issue for the middle.
Originally Posted by NorahBugg
... I ...

Okay, the people for whom gay marriage is more than a symbolic issue are those of us who might want to get one someday.

For him to abandon us in order to win reelection would be an awful move and I think I might even be more upset to think that was happening than to see Romney win. If we've got a Democrat as a President who won't do anything differently than any given Republican because he's trying to appease Congress and the electorate, what's the point?

Statistics have shown that support for marriage equality is increasing, rapidly and dramatically. Even if he loses in November, ultimately, that's where we're clearly headed, and he is doing the right thing by standing on the side of equality.
Originally Posted by amandamarie
In my opinion, gay marriage is more than a symbolic issue (it's an issue of equality so it's extremely important) which is why I put "symbolic" in quotes, to show that it's the author's opinion of how the Obama administration views the issue, not my opinion on the importance of the issue. Sorry if I wasn't clear. I'm angry that he didn't come out in support of this earlier, but does so now as part of a political strategy. It leads me to believe that he does see this issue as symbolic more than righteous and urgent. Also, I think what the author means by "symbolic" is that a president supporting an issue he is not expected to produce and push through legislation for (marriage is decided by states) is symbolic support for the issue.

I have marched for marriage equality even though I won't get one and take issue with the institution of marriage. If it exists, people deserve equal access to it. There are benefits attached to marriage that everyone deserves.
Formerly Urbancurl.
Medium-high density, fine-medium, low-normal porosity, 3b/c, permanent color.
CG, no heat, combs, brushes, parabens.
Fall/Winter HG=Alba Botanica Soft Hold Style Cream.
Spring/Summer HG=MGA Sculpting Gel
Current fave LI=Madre Labs Made by Nature for Baby Conditioner.
Limit oils, butters, glycerin.

Last edited by diaspora; 05-10-2012 at 01:58 PM. Reason: repeat words

Got to say I can't believe that's true, but if it is, it means Team Obama is in major danger. He absolutely can't afford to lose anyone in his base. At the same time I'm sorry but Obama can't afford for more than a second of his time to go to keeping young and left-wing voters. If he doesn't already have them he's already screwed. It's all about moving to the middle if he wants to win and gay marriage is waaay more than a symbolic issue for the middle.
Originally Posted by NorahBugg
... I ...

Okay, the people for whom gay marriage is more than a symbolic issue are those of us who might want to get one someday.

For him to abandon us in order to win reelection would be an awful move and I think I might even be more upset to think that was happening than to see Romney win. If we've got a Democrat as a President who won't do anything differently than any given Republican because he's trying to appease Congress and the electorate, what's the point?

Statistics have shown that support for marriage equality is increasing, rapidly and dramatically. Even if he loses in November, ultimately, that's where we're clearly headed, and he is doing the right thing by standing on the side of equality.
Originally Posted by amandamarie
In my opinion, gay marriage is more than a symbolic issue (it's an issue of equality so it's extremely important) which is why I put "symbolic" in quotes, to show that it's the author's opinion of how the Obama administration views the issue, not my opinion on the importance of the issue. Sorry if I wasn't clear. I'm angry that he didn't come out in support of this earlier, but does so now as part of a political strategy. It leads me to believe that he does see this issue as symbolic more than righteous and urgent.

I have marched for marriage equality even though I won't get one and take issue with the institution of marriage. If it exists, people deserve equal access to it. There are benefits attached to marriage that everyone deserves.
Originally Posted by diaspora
Diaspora, I wasn't really sure what you meant by that comment, so thanks for clarifying, but I wasn't too concerned about it, because I've seen you express your views in other threads on this site. I was pointing to NorahBugg's comment that "gay marriage is waaay more than a symbolic issue for the middle."

This attitude bothers me simply because if I did marry a woman, my marriage would have no effect AT ALL on anyone's marriage but my own. I can't conceive of a reason other than pure bigotry that would cause someone to actively oppose marriage equality when it would not have any direct impact on their lives. Certainly, Catholic priests wouldn't suddenly be required to perform what they consider to be the sacrament of marriage for gay and lesbian couples. It isn't eroding the sanctity of Catholic marriages any more than keeping divorce legal or allowing people to get married in a courthouse is.
Nallia, thelio and diaspora like this.
2a/b (really thick but sort of fine with pretty weak waves), medium-to-fine texture, normal porosity (I think). Doesn't seem to like protein.

Favorite products: Kinky-Curly Knot Today, Kinky-Curly Curling Custard, Curl Junkie Curls in a Bottle, Curl Junkie Curl Rehab, Curl Junkie Curl Assurance Smoothing Lotion, Shea Moisture Curl and Style Milk, homemade flaxseed gel.

Still looking for a cleanser I like.
Also, anybody see this article about Mitt Romney being a bully towards an ostensibly gay kid in high school? Mitt Romney’s prep school classmates recall pranks, but also troubling incidents - The Washington Post

I wouldn't be surprised if gay rights end up being the make or break issue in this election after all.
2a/b (really thick but sort of fine with pretty weak waves), medium-to-fine texture, normal porosity (I think). Doesn't seem to like protein.

Favorite products: Kinky-Curly Knot Today, Kinky-Curly Curling Custard, Curl Junkie Curls in a Bottle, Curl Junkie Curl Rehab, Curl Junkie Curl Assurance Smoothing Lotion, Shea Moisture Curl and Style Milk, homemade flaxseed gel.

Still looking for a cleanser I like.
Also, anybody see this article about Mitt Romney being a bully towards an ostensibly gay kid in high school? Mitt Romney’s prep school classmates recall pranks, but also troubling incidents - The Washington Post

I wouldn't be surprised if gay rights end up being the make or break issue in this election after all.
Originally Posted by amandamarie
Ack! That's horrible!

I would love to see gay rights as a major issue this election, and not just marriage equality but the other kinds of discrimination that lgbtq people experience that are not discussed much, like the health inequality, wealth inequality, and greater homelessness that lgbtq people experience.
Formerly Urbancurl.
Medium-high density, fine-medium, low-normal porosity, 3b/c, permanent color.
CG, no heat, combs, brushes, parabens.
Fall/Winter HG=Alba Botanica Soft Hold Style Cream.
Spring/Summer HG=MGA Sculpting Gel
Current fave LI=Madre Labs Made by Nature for Baby Conditioner.
Limit oils, butters, glycerin.

... I ...

Okay, the people for whom gay marriage is more than a symbolic issue are those of us who might want to get one someday.

For him to abandon us in order to win reelection would be an awful move and I think I might even be more upset to think that was happening than to see Romney win. If we've got a Democrat as a President who won't do anything differently than any given Republican because he's trying to appease Congress and the electorate, what's the point?

Statistics have shown that support for marriage equality is increasing, rapidly and dramatically. Even if he loses in November, ultimately, that's where we're clearly headed, and he is doing the right thing by standing on the side of equality.
Originally Posted by amandamarie
In my opinion, gay marriage is more than a symbolic issue (it's an issue of equality so it's extremely important) which is why I put "symbolic" in quotes, to show that it's the author's opinion of how the Obama administration views the issue, not my opinion on the importance of the issue. Sorry if I wasn't clear. I'm angry that he didn't come out in support of this earlier, but does so now as part of a political strategy. It leads me to believe that he does see this issue as symbolic more than righteous and urgent.

I have marched for marriage equality even though I won't get one and take issue with the institution of marriage. If it exists, people deserve equal access to it. There are benefits attached to marriage that everyone deserves.
Originally Posted by diaspora
Diaspora, I wasn't really sure what you meant by that comment, so thanks for clarifying, but I wasn't too concerned about it, because I've seen you express your views in other threads on this site. I was pointing to NorahBugg's comment that "gay marriage is waaay more than a symbolic issue for the middle."

This attitude bothers me simply because if I did marry a woman, my marriage would have no effect AT ALL on anyone's marriage but my own. I can't conceive of a reason other than pure bigotry that would cause someone to actively oppose marriage equality when it would not have any direct impact on their lives. Certainly, Catholic priests wouldn't suddenly be required to perform what they consider to be the sacrament of marriage for gay and lesbian couples. It isn't eroding the sanctity of Catholic marriages any more than keeping divorce legal or allowing people to get married in a courthouse is.
Originally Posted by amandamarie
What you quoted isn't my viewpoint, it's a political fact of life. I don't look at social issues very closely when voting for a President like I said before because the choices are usually both pretty close on those issues, and I do tend to look at economic issues more. I'm also on the fence on many social issues or I have a side, but open to changing course like I am on this one.

Gay marriage is an issue that's tough for me. My issue with legalizing gay marriage is will it force churches to marry gay couples? If our religion doesn't believe in it, our Church shouldn't have to marry gay couples. Likewise, I don't think churches should be involved with the government, either, as in we should not accept funds if we don't want to the government to tell our institutions what to do.

It's kind of a confusing issue because it seems like every state is different. There were civil union states, and gay marriage states. Now I don't know of any civil union states and there are states with gay marriage bans. Since my state (Ohio) has a ban in place, I don't expect it to come up to vote any time soon. I haven't thought a whole lot about it because of this and since the economic issues are so real in my life and in my state's economy. I know that may frustrate you amandamarie but this has given me a lot to think about and I assure you I'll be doing a lot more thinking about it.
And then there's this, from April 12th-- Obama won't ban discrimination on gay contractors - From the Wires - Salon.com

Doesn't look like Obama's putting his money where his mouth is IMO.
Formerly Urbancurl.
Medium-high density, fine-medium, low-normal porosity, 3b/c, permanent color.
CG, no heat, combs, brushes, parabens.
Fall/Winter HG=Alba Botanica Soft Hold Style Cream.
Spring/Summer HG=MGA Sculpting Gel
Current fave LI=Madre Labs Made by Nature for Baby Conditioner.
Limit oils, butters, glycerin.
Also, anybody see this article about Mitt Romney being a bully towards an ostensibly gay kid in high school? Mitt Romney’s prep school classmates recall pranks, but also troubling incidents - The Washington Post

I wouldn't be surprised if gay rights end up being the make or break issue in this election after all.
Originally Posted by amandamarie
Ack! That's horrible!

I would love to see gay rights as a major issue this election, and not just marriage equality but the other kinds of discrimination that lgbtq people experience that are not discussed much, like the health inequality, wealth inequality, and greater homelessness that lgbtq people experience.
Originally Posted by diaspora
SAAAAAAAAME. And bullying. And trans* issues.

Like, obviously I support marriage equality, but it makes me feel a little icky that it's the number one issue we talk about.
2a/b (really thick but sort of fine with pretty weak waves), medium-to-fine texture, normal porosity (I think). Doesn't seem to like protein.

Favorite products: Kinky-Curly Knot Today, Kinky-Curly Curling Custard, Curl Junkie Curls in a Bottle, Curl Junkie Curl Rehab, Curl Junkie Curl Assurance Smoothing Lotion, Shea Moisture Curl and Style Milk, homemade flaxseed gel.

Still looking for a cleanser I like.
Also, anybody see this article about Mitt Romney being a bully towards an ostensibly gay kid in high school? Mitt Romney’s prep school classmates recall pranks, but also troubling incidents - The Washington Post

I wouldn't be surprised if gay rights end up being the make or break issue in this election after all.
Originally Posted by amandamarie
Ack! That's horrible!

I would love to see gay rights as a major issue this election, and not just marriage equality but the other kinds of discrimination that lgbtq people experience that are not discussed much, like the health inequality, wealth inequality, and greater homelessness that lgbtq people experience.
Originally Posted by diaspora
SAAAAAAAAME. And bullying. And trans* issues.

Like, obviously I support marriage equality, but it makes me feel a little icky that it's the number one issue we talk about.
Originally Posted by amandamarie
+1!

You know why I think it is the issue that gets the most media coverage? Because marriage equality is not an issue that causes many people to feel threatened since it will not take anything away from them. Remedying job and wage discrimination particularly frightens many people because they fear they will lose something if others get their fare share, which is bs of course. I think we'll see issues like bullying and marriage of course addressed long before we see the other issues addressed.
Formerly Urbancurl.
Medium-high density, fine-medium, low-normal porosity, 3b/c, permanent color.
CG, no heat, combs, brushes, parabens.
Fall/Winter HG=Alba Botanica Soft Hold Style Cream.
Spring/Summer HG=MGA Sculpting Gel
Current fave LI=Madre Labs Made by Nature for Baby Conditioner.
Limit oils, butters, glycerin.
Gay marriage is an issue that's tough for me. My issue with legalizing gay marriage is will it force churches to marry gay couples? If our religion doesn't believe in it, our Church shouldn't have to marry gay couples. Likewise, I don't think churches should be involved with the government, either, as in we should not accept funds if we don't want to the government to tell our institutions what to do.
Originally Posted by NorahBugg
If it did, I wouldn't support that ...? I don't think most proponents of same-sex couples getting married would want to force any churches to perform the marriages. It's the same as letting Catholic churches turn away non-Catholics who want to get married, to me.
2a/b (really thick but sort of fine with pretty weak waves), medium-to-fine texture, normal porosity (I think). Doesn't seem to like protein.

Favorite products: Kinky-Curly Knot Today, Kinky-Curly Curling Custard, Curl Junkie Curls in a Bottle, Curl Junkie Curl Rehab, Curl Junkie Curl Assurance Smoothing Lotion, Shea Moisture Curl and Style Milk, homemade flaxseed gel.

Still looking for a cleanser I like.
Gay marriage is an issue that's tough for me. My issue with legalizing gay marriage is will it force churches to marry gay couples? If our religion doesn't believe in it, our Church shouldn't have to marry gay couples. Likewise, I don't think churches should be involved with the government, either, as in we should not accept funds if we don't want to the government to tell our institutions what to do.
Originally Posted by NorahBugg
If it did, I wouldn't support that ...? I don't think most proponents of same-sex couples getting married would want to force any churches to perform the marriages. It's the same as letting Catholic churches turn away non-Catholics who want to get married, to me.
Originally Posted by amandamarie
Also, I doubt same-sex couples will be lining up to get married in churches that object to their right to do so.
Formerly Urbancurl.
Medium-high density, fine-medium, low-normal porosity, 3b/c, permanent color.
CG, no heat, combs, brushes, parabens.
Fall/Winter HG=Alba Botanica Soft Hold Style Cream.
Spring/Summer HG=MGA Sculpting Gel
Current fave LI=Madre Labs Made by Nature for Baby Conditioner.
Limit oils, butters, glycerin.
Marriage is a legal contract. Even when you get married in a church, you're not actually married until the officiant signs your marriage certificate. So, no, churches are not going to be legally required to marry same sex couples.


Obamacare is not a blueprint for socialism. You're thinking of the New Testament. ~~ John Fugelsang



Gay marriage is an issue that's tough for me. My issue with legalizing gay marriage is will it force churches to marry gay couples? If our religion doesn't believe in it, our Church shouldn't have to marry gay couples. Likewise, I don't think churches should be involved with the government, either, as in we should not accept funds if we don't want to the government to tell our institutions what to do.
Originally Posted by NorahBugg
If it did, I wouldn't support that ...? I don't think most proponents of same-sex couples getting married would want to force any churches to perform the marriages. It's the same as letting Catholic churches turn away non-Catholics who want to get married, to me.
Originally Posted by amandamarie
Also, I doubt same-sex couples will be lining up to get married in churches that object to their right to do so.
Originally Posted by diaspora
I'm quite sure there are Catholic gay people in the U.S.... seeing as it is the largest Christian denomination. I can imagine not wanting to get married in any other place or at least wanting the Church to recognize my marriage. That's why it is a difficult issue because on the other hand, I don't think churches should be forced to abide by a gay marriage law. If it becomes law, I definitely see how it could be enforced in that way.
Marriage is a legal contract. Even when you get married in a church, you're not actually married until the officiant signs your marriage certificate. So, no, churches are not going to be legally required to marry same sex couples.
Originally Posted by Springcurl
I read this over a couple of times but I'm not seeing how it explains why churches won't be required to marry same sex couples, if it is written into law. The government is already blocking funds for Catholic institutions because they don't want to give out birth control. I believe even if there isn't government enforcement, there will be pressure on all religious institutions to marry gay couples. If that isn't the case, I would support (vote for) gay marriage but I'd have to trust that it is first.
Marriage is a legal contract. Even when you get married in a church, you're not actually married until the officiant signs your marriage certificate. So, no, churches are not going to be legally required to marry same sex couples.
Originally Posted by Springcurl
I read this over a couple of times but I'm not seeing how it explains why churches won't be required to marry same sex couples, if it is written into law. The government is already blocking funds for Catholic institutions because they don't want to give out birth control. I believe even if there isn't government enforcement, there will be pressure on all religious institutions to marry gay couples. If that isn't the case, I would support (vote for) gay marriage but I'd have to trust that it is first.
Originally Posted by NorahBugg
Churches are separate institutions that do not get government money. Marriage in a church is only a religious sacrament so they can't be forced to perform that rite.

Religious institutions that get government money are, I believe, what you're referring to regarding birth control. However, I believe you are in error that the government is blocking funds for Catholic institutions. The compromise was that insurance companies themselves would provide birth control rather than the institutions.
roseannadana and scrills like this.


Obamacare is not a blueprint for socialism. You're thinking of the New Testament. ~~ John Fugelsang




Last edited by Springcurl; 05-10-2012 at 04:18 PM.

If it did, I wouldn't support that ...? I don't think most proponents of same-sex couples getting married would want to force any churches to perform the marriages. It's the same as letting Catholic churches turn away non-Catholics who want to get married, to me.
Originally Posted by amandamarie
Also, I doubt same-sex couples will be lining up to get married in churches that object to their right to do so.
Originally Posted by diaspora
I'm quite sure there are Catholic gay people in the U.S.... seeing as it is the largest Christian denomination. I can imagine not wanting to get married in any other place or at least wanting the Church to recognize my marriage. That's why it is a difficult issue because on the other hand, I don't think churches should be forced to abide by a gay marriage law. If it becomes law, I definitely see how it could be enforced in that way.
Originally Posted by NorahBugg
Yes, of course there are gay Catholics (including my ex-girlfriend, actually). From my observation, those individuals come to terms with the intersection of their faith and their sexual identity in different ways that are really personal. For me, I chose to leave the Catholic Church at about age sixteen for reasons along these lines before I came out to even myself (I find the Catholic Church's attitude on this issue to be incredibly inconsistent and hypocritical for various reasons I won't get into here but if you're curious we can talk privately about it). Others, I find, simply accept that their Church doesn't entirely support their romantic relationships (just like the millions of Catholics who get divorced or live with their partners before marriage or use birth control or whatever else); I can understand taking this position, but I am not sure I'd feel comfortable with it personally. And there are others who I think believe the Church has its own prejudices to deal with and who hope to encourage (slow) change from within. I'm sure there are tons of others who simply believe their sexual identities are sinful and shameful and aren't out at all.

It may be true that some of those people would want the Catholic Church to be legally forced to marry them if they want to be married, but I think (and this is a "from my observation" opinion rather than a "statistics indicate that" opinion) the majority would either accept, with regret, that the Church gets to decide that for itself, or would take the attitude of choosing to separate from an institution that does not accept them, at least when it comes to their marriage.
2a/b (really thick but sort of fine with pretty weak waves), medium-to-fine texture, normal porosity (I think). Doesn't seem to like protein.

Favorite products: Kinky-Curly Knot Today, Kinky-Curly Curling Custard, Curl Junkie Curls in a Bottle, Curl Junkie Curl Rehab, Curl Junkie Curl Assurance Smoothing Lotion, Shea Moisture Curl and Style Milk, homemade flaxseed gel.

Still looking for a cleanser I like.

Trending Topics


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:29 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2011 NaturallyCurly.com