anonnymouse

This is coming up locked for me and I can't read whatever you all are talking about. Is it gone? Or is there somewhere else I can be pointed to?

__________________

internetchick

Here you go

Peppy

Wow.

Elicia

YEP i agree with most of this post .
i don't agree that all parents should be honoured especially if they were horrible, but don't write anything at all if you are going that route .
I also think that if there was a little bit of good in that woman maybe they should have added it to the obit and not just the bad . to each their own i guess i hope they get some peace out of the death and that they have someone in their life that can spare a civil word when they die .

__________________

national anthem for self-pity
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zawR7VYNdNg

Sleigh

if parents abuse or neglect their children, they don't deserve to be honored in life or death.

misspam

I have to strongly disagree with the bolded part. Of course, I am merely assuming the worst for her to receive such a public rebuke by seemingly her entire family. But none of us really has any idea what pain, heartache, abuse or other crap this woman was responsible for. In my mind there are a few lines that a parent can cross that justifies ripping up their parent card.

I don't believe any child is morally or spiritually obligated to honor any parental relationship when certain boundaries are crossed. My point is no one except her family knows the truth so a blanket statement about honoring your mother just because she's your mother, doesn't sit well with me.

If in writing the obit the family is able to move on with their lives, I say more power to them. Honestly, I didn't think it was all that bad. It's not like they catalogued all of her offenses - now that may have gone too far.

My answer to the OP's question, "Do you know anyone who deserves this?" sadly, is yes. If you were one of the lucky ones to have a loving and close-knit family, I envy you. Many people are not so lucky.

__________________

meryn

Absolutely agree. Anger IS healthy. To name it, to pin in directly on the guilty party (even after death, even as an "elder"), is completely appropriate.

Honor and respect, is earned. Just because they gave you life, doesn't give them permission to rip the breath out of your soul.

cympreni

If people only spoke nicely of ones who committed terrible deeds, then many of the world's evil would go unnoticed and unchecked.

If it wasn't for the brave people who spoke out about the things that happened to them, many of the laws that protect people wouldn't exist. Child abuse, rape, domestic violence, animal abuse, at one point in time these crimes weren't considered crimes, but private matters. But because people chose to speak up and not stay silent that we do, and the number of lives it has saved is incalculable.

So often these terrible things happen in the dark behind closed doors, alone, they shouldn't have to suffer that way forever.

mrspoppers

I know there are people out there who deserve this kind of send-off. I don't think I'd write an obituary like this--I'd probably just not write one--but I can't jusge whoever wrote it.

I wonder if everyone saying how they can't imagine anyone being this awful or not having a speck of good in them would say the same thing if it was written about a father instead of a mother. I think it might be easier to imagine a horrible father than a horrible mother, but it doesn't mean horrible mothers don't exist.

yagottaloveyacurls

wow. I hope that one day these folks can forgive this woman for whatever it is she did, because I think that's really the only way healing can take place. I can't judge because I don't know the story... but you can't really overcome evil with evil, so to speak. (not "evil" literally... you guys know what I mean.)

Just sad all around.
I mean, what if the woman who died went through something absolutely horrendous as a child and she never told anyone... maybe whatever she did was because of something that happened to HER. Maybe she had a mental illness. I don't know, this is just really sad and depressing.

__________________
Healing Women - Please help.

cympreni

IMO that is no excuse. Everyone has choices. Many people have lived through horrendous stuff and never caused harm to another living being.

Both Hitler and Stalin had horrendous childhoods and mental illness. Their childhood stories would make you sick to your stomach, they are so bad. Hitler's dad beat him so severely one time he was in the hospital for a month! But that doesn't change the fact that they were both monsters with a body count in the millions or more. They made a choice to end a life with each and every death.

CurlyEyes

I'm sorry, but I have to disagee.

Last year, I was really good friends with this girl, let's say Sue. Sue and I had lockers right across from each other, and whenever we changed for gym, I always saw the bruises down her back. She would have burn marks on her stomach and came to school once with handprints on her neck. She finally told me that yes, she was abused. Whenever she missed school, I would fear for her life. CPS finally visited her, and her mom got off scot free. Again.

Having a mental illness does not excuse you from abusing your child. Having a crappy past doesn't mean that you deserve to be an awful person. Sue doesn't victimize herself. She doesn't make everyone else feel bad. If she can, why can't this woman?

Now, I don't know the whole story. But I think that if that woman was half as bad as Sue's mother, she deserves that obituary.

Sue will never forgive her mother. Sue is 13 years old and has been fending for her life every day since she was six years old. The only true healing she will get is once her mother is dead and long gone. And maybe not even then.

anonnymouse

Thanks for posting it so I could see it.


And...wow. Whoever wrote this must have been through a lot at the hands of that woman. I do think it's kind of in poor taste to have done it, but I can almost understand needing it for a release.

I do not agree that parents should be honored unconditionally. Some people who have children are, frankly, not fit to raise them, and do far more harm than good. Respect and honor need to be earned.

__________________

yagottaloveyacurls

Oh, trust me I know. My mother and father both had absolutely horrendous childhoods, but they both came out of it never wanting anyone to hurt. My mom was a very loving person and my dad has a heart of gold.
Different people deal with things in different ways. I'm just saying, more bitterness, strife and anger isn't going to turn anything around. It only makes things worse. It only makes that person's legacy live ON. What I was saying was I hope those people can someday forgive... because forgiveness brings about a great deal of healing. You can't hold onto anger... it will kill you. I just can't go along with the notion that it's ok to keep being angry. I know that may get me slammed, but I can't just sit here and say what I think will be popular thing to say, or the thing that won't ruffle feathers. Anger and strife are destructive if you hold onto it tightly and never release it. I always hear "I have a RIGHT to be angry!!!" Yes, you have a RIGHT to be angry... but it's not right at all, to keep it close to you for the rest of your life. It will only destroy you.

__________________
Healing Women - Please help.

automaticflowers

ITA. But maybe this obituary is the writer's, or the family's, way of letting go of some of that. Maybe for them, it's part of the process of getting better. That's what I'm hoping was part of the purpose of this obit.

I know I write a lot of things when I'm angry or hurt, that later on might even make me feel bad. But at the moment, those things needed to be purged.

__________________
http://unpavedpath.blogspot.com/

yagottaloveyacurls

Yeah, I thought that too. I was thinking maybe this is the path to their healing... and maybe one day they'll look back on that obituary, and feel sad that they even wrote it. Like I said, man, this is just so sad all around for all involved. I'd love to think that somewhere along the line, these people heal...

__________________
Healing Women - Please help.

cympreni

I think it is part of their healing process, it's even mentioned in it. As someone who's done something similar but in a private setting, it sounds like a confrontation letter to me. And I don't mean confrontation in the aggressive sense. When you confront someone who hurt you and name them, you take their power away, even if that power exists in your own mind. It is a crucial step to healing. I would think, from personal experience if they were being angry, they would talk about specifics. But they kept it very general, giving us just enough to realize they probably had good reason for it.

Piglet

I think for some people, you could never stoop low enough to get to their level.

I also don't agree that because you have no other parents, you should honour them. That just doesn't make sense.

__________________
Yes, my tail is naturally curly.
No, it was NOT me who cried 'wee wee wee wee wee' all the way home.

Amneris

Yagotta said it so well when she said this:


more bitterness, strife and anger isn't going to turn anything around. It only makes things worse. It only makes that person's legacy live ON. What I was saying was I hope those people can someday forgive... because forgiveness brings about a great deal of healing. You can't hold onto anger... it will kill you. I just can't go along with the notion that it's ok to keep being angry. I know that may get me slammed, but I can't just sit here and say what I think will be popular thing to say, or the thing that won't ruffle feathers. Anger and strife are destructive if you hold onto it tightly and never release it. I always hear "I have a RIGHT to be angry!!!" Yes, you have a RIGHT to be angry... but it's not right at all, to keep it close to you for the rest of your life. It will only destroy you.

I totally agree with every word of this.

What I mean is this (and I know not everyone believes in God; these are just MY beliefs) is that God gives you your parents, and gives parents their children, for a reason. If they are reasonably good parents, then those are the people who show you love and shape you. If they are bad or terrible parents, then maybe they show you who NOT to be or lead you to better things, or something. But you will never be able to change them for anyone else. And like yagotta said, if they were bad, abusive parents, then you "honour" them by ending their legacy and being and getting better for yourself. If they were good parents then you love others the way they loved you. If some was good and some was bad, then you try to discard the bad and keep the good.

I do feel for the family of that woman and I hope that publishing that obit does help them heal. I can't even imagine some of the possibilities of what they might have been through. I wonder how the two deceased children died and if she had anything to do with that or if their deaths somehow scarred her.

As to the point that having had a bad childhood or bad experiences don't excuse bad behaviour, that is true. My grandmama had a hard childhood that I can't even imagine, but from that, she got her mantra that children need love and you can never love a child too much. That's the type of mother and grandmother she was, and as a result, I was so blessed to be raised with so much love, and that's the love I want to give my child. So it's not necessarily true that going through pain and abuse stops anyone from loving or forever ruins and scars a family. But not everyone reacts to things the same way, and I think that there's a reason why we look at things like child abuse so negatively and with so much anger: because we KNOW it permanently scars some people and some families so much that they never recover, and some then abuse others as a result. That may not excuse it, but I find sometimes that when you have been hurt by someone it does help to put their actions into the proper context.

On a much lesser scale, I have an aunt who can be verbally abusive and has some very disturbing habits and ideas - but most of them can be traced to things that happened growing up due to colonialism and racism, and it makes it easier to tolerate being spoken to in that way knowing that how she was treated was so much worse... and also makes it easier to avoid doing the same things.

__________________
Get used to me. Black, confident, cocky; my name, not yours; my religion, not yours; my goals, my own; get used to me. -Muhammad Ali

The New Black

The Bible says "Honor thy mother and father so your days will be long in the land" or something like that. I think this is partly where Am is taking her beliefs.

I see both sides. It takes time for abuse victims to become survivors, IMO.