Vaccine-Autism study was a FRAUD

I have one child that is vaccinated, and one child that is not vaccinated yet.

I prefer to be an idiot.
Originally Posted by babywavy
I know a message board comment won't change your mind, but you are subjecting one of your children to a known risk because you are worried about an unknown risk. Unvaccinated children have died of preventable diseases in the US and UK, but there is no link between vaccines and autism.

Also, I remember that in a past thread, you stated that you don't get flu shots partly because "they can cause the flu." In fact, they can't cause the flu, because they use a dead virus. So, well, I hope you've done your research.

I just felt I had to say it. You can tell me I'm being nosy or calling you a bad mom (which I'm not) or whatever.
Originally Posted by Eilonwy


I don't think you're calling me a bad mom. I think you have your own opinion, which everyone is entitled to. If not, we wouldn't have people who were, or were not vaccinated in order for us to have this conversation.

And I'm pretty sure I didn't say that we don't get flu shots b/c they cause the flu. I mean, I may have spoken about it, but I don't think I stated that as the reason cause that's really not the reason.
I have one child that is vaccinated, and one child that is not vaccinated yet.

I prefer to be an idiot.
Originally Posted by babywavy
What made you decide to vaccinate one and not the other? What changed?
Originally Posted by Amneris
Bailey exhibited strong signs of autism around 15 months old. I went through 2 years of being at my wits end while my child would easily get thrown into hour long temper tantrums a couple of times a day where we just couldn't get through to her. I earned my medical degree in Google when it had gone on long enough and I combined all the behaviors together and began researching.

The short story, I was able to curb her outbursts by removing dairy from her diet and introducing acidophillus daily. The difference in her behavior, communication - ability to hold a converstion - it was all just amazing.

The reponse I get from doctors is a half assed shrug where I'm told that she's okay because she maintains eye contact - like that's the only thing that would point to autism.

I haven't decided if it's worth having testing done because of how well I maintain her at home, there isn't much else that could be done anyway.

I'm choosing to not vaccinate for something that may or may not happen to avoid someone else that may or may not happen.

I will probably begin vaccinating Bella before she goes to school, but I am not happy about it.

Yes, I am very uncomfortable having something injected into my children, trusting it's really what they say it is, and that it won't do any damage to them. To prevent something that they have a rare chance of coming into contact with anyway.
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My brother got them when he was around 9 or 10. I hadn't gotten them yet, and I was 16. (this was in the 90's, so before the shot. I THINK) My mother, not wanting me to wind up in the hosiptial like her sister, made sure I got them.
Originally Posted by Trenell
Welp here's another PSA: Doctors recommend against exposing your children to chicken pox. You never know if it could go terribly wrong (like the child mentioned in this thread, who died from it).
Originally Posted by Eilonwy
Yes, I'm sure you have heard of these 'parties' that are thrown...
My brother got them when he was around 9 or 10. I hadn't gotten them yet, and I was 16. (this was in the 90's, so before the shot. I THINK) My mother, not wanting me to wind up in the hosiptial like her sister, made sure I got them.
Originally Posted by Trenell
Welp here's another PSA: Doctors recommend against exposing your children to chicken pox. You never know if it could go terribly wrong (like the child mentioned in this thread, who died from it).
Originally Posted by Eilonwy
No doubt. I'm not saying that I would do it. This was in th early 90's. I think my mother even asks the pediatrician


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Last edited by Trenell; 02-10-2009 at 06:51 PM.
I have one child that is vaccinated, and one child that is not vaccinated yet.

I prefer to be an idiot.
Originally Posted by babywavy

Add me to the list of idiots, only all 3 of my children either aren't vaccinated (youngest) or we stopped when they were two (the two oldest).
I make the decision to protect my children and no one can tell me to do otherwise. You're right, your one thread, or a million others you decide to create, will not make me change my mind. If and when I have more children, I will not be vaccinating them.

When I made the decision to not vax my kids, I didn't know about the problem with causing an allergic reaction in newborns that isn't curable.
The following link is heartbreaking. Don't look or read if you can't handle a 47 day old child dying.

http://iansvoice.org/default.aspx

You can post your anecdotal stories about children dying from chicken pox, and I can post my anecdotal stories of children dying from vaccines. In the end, every single parent needs to decide what is best for their own child. I won't ever tell a parent not to vax just because I don't. What I tell any parent who asks me is to research the diseases, the vaccines, the risks and side effects (documented) and make their own informed decision for their own family. My husband and I alone are responsible for our children. Not the doctor trying to push the vax on me, not the snotty ER attendant, not the drug company who is conveniently protected by the government if anything goes wrong, and not anyone on a message board. I have to live with whatever happens to my children, no one else.
Hmm, looks like something struck a nerve in me. I suppose being called an idiot and implied ignorance irritates me.
There's no such thing as global warming. Chuck Norris was cold so he turned up the sun.

Last edited by cynaminbear; 02-10-2009 at 08:21 PM. Reason: forgot a key word
I've met parents IRL that seem to have this super enlightened attitude when they talk about not vaccinating their kids. Like "Other parents can be mindless morons and inject their kids with that stuff but I'm not. They won't get any of these diseases and I won't risk them getting hurt by a vaccine."

I think to myself, the only reason you have the luxury of not worrying about your kid contracting these diseases is because the mindless morons vaccinated their kids and these diseases aren't around like they used to be. So the chances of them getting it a low.

So while I'm not saying vaccinate or don't vaccinate or whatever, I wish some parents who don't vaccinate would look at the bigger picture and drop the attitude. I've seen it too many times.


*ETA- I'm sure parents take it into consideration that they're child may contract something. But they feel the risk is low enough that they make the decision not to vaccinate. But it's about why the risk is low enough in the first place that some people seem to disregard.
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Last edited by Bianca; 02-10-2009 at 08:51 PM.
I've met parents IRL that seem to have this super enlightened attitude when they talk about not vaccinating their kids. Like "Other parents can be mindless morons and inject their kids with that stuff but I'm not. They won't get any of these diseases and I won't risk them getting hurt by a vaccine."

I think to myself, the only reason you have the luxury of not worrying about your kid contracting these diseases is because the mindless morons vaccinated their kids and these diseases aren't around like they used to be. So the chances of them getting it a low.

So while I'm not saying vaccinate or don't vaccinate or whatever, I wish some parents who don't vaccinate would look at the bigger picture and drop the attitude. I've seen it too many times.


*ETA- I'm sure parents take it into consideration that they're child may contract something. But they feel the risk is low enough that they make the decision not to vaccinate. But it's about why the risk is low enough in the first place that some people seem to disregard.
Originally Posted by Bianca
Yep.
I have one child that is vaccinated, and one child that is not vaccinated yet.

I prefer to be an idiot.
Originally Posted by babywavy

Add me to the list of idiots, only all 3 of my children either aren't vaccinated (youngest) or we stopped when they were two (the two oldest).
I make the decision to protect my children and no one can tell me to do otherwise. You're right, your one thread, or a million others you decide to create, will not make me change my mind. If and when I have more children, I will not be vaccinating them.

When I made the decision to not vax my kids, I didn't know about the problem with causing an allergic reaction in newborns that isn't curable.
The following link is heartbreaking. Don't look or read if you can't handle a 47 day old child dying.

http://iansvoice.org/default.aspx

You can post your anecdotal stories about children dying from chicken pox, and I can post my anecdotal stories of children dying from vaccines. In the end, every single parent needs to decide what is best for their own child. I won't ever tell a parent not to vax just because I don't. What I tell any parent who asks me is to research the diseases, the vaccines, the risks and side effects (documented) and make their own informed decision for their own family. My husband and I alone are responsible for our children. Not the doctor trying to push the vax on me, not the snotty ER attendant, not the drug company who is conveniently protected by the government if anything goes wrong, and not anyone on a message board. I have to live with whatever happens to my children, no one else.
Hmm, looks like something struck a nerve in me. I suppose being called an idiot and implied ignorance irritates me.
Originally Posted by cynaminbear
Completely agree with the bolded. Regardless of what I read, or what any doctor does/doesn't tell me, the choice in the end is ultimately MINE (and my husbands).
I have one child that is vaccinated, and one child that is not vaccinated yet.

I prefer to be an idiot.
Originally Posted by babywavy

Add me to the list of idiots, only all 3 of my children either aren't vaccinated (youngest) or we stopped when they were two (the two oldest).
I make the decision to protect my children and no one can tell me to do otherwise. You're right, your one thread, or a million others you decide to create, will not make me change my mind. If and when I have more children, I will not be vaccinating them.

When I made the decision to not vax my kids, I didn't know about the problem with causing an allergic reaction in newborns that isn't curable.
The following link is heartbreaking. Don't look or read if you can't handle a 47 day old child dying.

http://iansvoice.org/default.aspx

You can post your anecdotal stories about children dying from chicken pox, and I can post my anecdotal stories of children dying from vaccines. In the end, every single parent needs to decide what is best for their own child. I won't ever tell a parent not to vax just because I don't. What I tell any parent who asks me is to research the diseases, the vaccines, the risks and side effects (documented) and make their own informed decision for their own family. My husband and I alone are responsible for our children. Not the doctor trying to push the vax on me, not the snotty ER attendant, not the drug company who is conveniently protected by the government if anything goes wrong, and not anyone on a message board. I have to live with whatever happens to my children, no one else.
Hmm, looks like something struck a nerve in me. I suppose being called an idiot and implied ignorance irritates me.
Originally Posted by cynaminbear


I agree completely. Everybody had an agenda, and unfortunately, in the medical/vaccination world, it's money.

Bailey too has not had a vax since two, and Bella had the first 2 sets at 2 mos and 4 mos and I stopped.

I've been struggling with whether or not to start Bellas back up again before school.

CB - if you could, pm me w/ some info of how you handled school w/o vaxing them.

Yes, I've done research, and I trust everything as opinion. I don't trust any government, scientific, medical research any more than I trust Jenny McCarthy's opinion - because as I've said, everyone has an agenda.
Are unvaccinated children even allowed into the public school system? I know that I had to prove various immunities via blood titers in order to go to nursing school (college, rather than departmental policy), and my son needs to have his immunization record in order to attend the day care that he's going to be starting in a few weeks. If I didn't provide this stuff, neither of us would be attending.

We did follow the CDC schedule for vaccinations, because my son hasn't had much, if any, negative reactions to getting any of the shots. If he did, I would've spaced them out a bit, but still gotten all of them. To be honest, unvaccinated children concern me greatly, because of the health risk they pose.
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Yes, no one can require you to get a vaccine. Your child (and you) can have medical or religious exemptions (except from WV and MS). Some states allow for conscience exemptions.
Here's the first link I found doing a yahoo search:
http://www.unhinderedliving.com/statevaccexemp.html

Many of the public school outbreaks of measles and other diseases with vaccines are among students who have already been vaccinated. If there is an outbreak at school, the unvaccinated child will be asked to stay home until the outbreak is under control. If there's an outbreak among vaccinated children, I think it's reasonable to keep all the kids home until the outbreak is over.

My kids have never missed out on any opportunities due to their vax status. It also wasn't an issue for getting our foster license as long as we understood any foster children in our home are required to be vaccinated. Since the state is the guardian, everything required by law is followed for foster children in our home.
There's no such thing as global warming. Chuck Norris was cold so he turned up the sun.

Last edited by cynaminbear; 02-11-2009 at 09:12 AM.
Are unvaccinated children even allowed into the public school system? I know that I had to prove various immunities via blood titers in order to go to nursing school (college, rather than departmental policy), and my son needs to have his immunization record in order to attend the day care that he's going to be starting in a few weeks. If I didn't provide this stuff, neither of us would be attending.
Originally Posted by velvet paws
It varies by state. States allow medical, religious and sometimes philosophical exemptions, and the requirements for each exemption also vary by state. New York only has medical and religious exemptions and I understand they are pretty stringent, as far as states go.
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Confidential medical documents and interviews with witnesses have established that Andrew Wakefield manipulated patients’ data, which triggered fears that the MMR triple vaccine to protect against measles, mumps and rubella was linked to the condition.

I can't wait to hear people (not in this thread) say that they'll still "err on the side of caution" and not vaccinate their children. Great job, Dr. Wakefield! You have manufactured an urban legend that will continue to live on, despite all evidence to the contrary, and could eventually lead to an epidemic!

Wow now we just need to promote the idea that condoms are full of little holes that let sperm and germs slip through!
Originally Posted by Eilonwy
Falsifying data is fraudulent. The collaborative associal effects or lack thereof that incurred said speculation were and are not. However, Whether or not you decide to receive a vaccination is your individual choice.

As the right to refuse any medical treatment is each individual’s right as by God so duly noted in the constitutional by laws (internationally and domestically) And the suffering that these parents of children with a predisposition to hormonal/etc. triggered or otherwise triggered onset is real and is not amusing in any way....

To even remotely compare a serious medical ethics violation to a condom joke is extremely inappropriate and uncalled for considering the reason and source for the initial medical revue of the medications, anyway. Medical Sarcasm intended.

ETA: Also The issue is more so that, why would these children be exposed, when DNA is catalogued/on file at birth.

Last edited by Hermoine™; 02-11-2009 at 09:27 AM.
I had a nice well thought out post, but the gremlin took it!!!

I am in the idiot group for now. My oldest is up to date, except for chicken pox (she was inadvertently exposed to it). My youngest two do not have their shots yet. I do expect everybody to be up to date overt the next few years. My daughter's leg had severe swelling after her last shot, and while I know this can fall in the normal range, I decided to back off for a litte bit.

To play devil's adovcate:

Those of you that argue for vaccines are you up to date on all of your shots? I imagine those of you in the medical field probably are, but what about the rest of you? I am not. Do you have the following: tetanus-diptheria-pertussis; HPV; Varicella; MMR; and if you have certain risk factors you should have Influenza; pneumococcal; hepatitis A; hepatitis B; and meningococcal vaccines?

To those of you that argue "herd mentality", are you up to date? Because I think it is fairly safe to assume most adults are not fully up to date on vaccines. If the argument is "your kid is safe unvaccinated because my kid is" then wouldn't adults be dropping like flies to all of these things? In order for everyone to be safe, booster shots are necessary for the vaccines to remain effective. Then again, maybe this is the reason so many of these things are making a comeback.
However, I have a pretty bad reaction to flu shots. They make my arm very sore and stiff for a couple of days. I skipped getting one this year, and plan not to get one for a few more years. I hope that by then, the strains will have changed enough.

But dammit, they make my arm hurt real bad!
Originally Posted by Eilonwy
I stopped with the flu shot a few years ago, because I could hardly lift my arm for days afterwards!!
I'm a bit weirded out by the idea of NO vaccines at all. (That doesn't mean I think anyone's an idiot--every parent has the right to decide what's best for their children.) I'm very fortunate that I grew up in a time and place where I never had to witness epidemics of these diseases, but I can imagine how absolutely terrifying those times must have been. But I do think that science has gone too far with all these vaccines...I've yet to read a single study that can convince me that the chicken pox vax, for example isn't ridiculous. It makes sense for older children and adults who've never had it, because it's much more severe the older you get, but for normal, healthy children, no. Sure, there can be serious problems, but I really want to see those numbers. I find it hard to believe that a significant percentage of chicken pox cases result in dangerous complications.

The vaccine-for-every-little-thing craze is just an extension of germphobia, and people really need to get over it. Life isn't meant to be sterile.
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