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-   -   What is Cheating? (http://www.naturallycurly.com/curltalk/non-hair-discussion/80744-what-cheating.html)

luvmylocs 07-16-2009 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josephine (Post 1029874)
Generally, to me cheating is something you wouldn't do in front of the other person. And you know what is acceptable or unacceptable to that person.

this plus i would say cheating and/or lying is anything you also wouldn't say, text, e-mail or do if your partner was in your presence. this is pretty cut and dry.

now if both people agree and are open about whatever such the ability to sleep with other people, the ability to text sexy messages to folks, send naked pics or whatever then no it's not cheating...it's whatever that couple is cool with.

there are different forms of cheating, emotional and so on. sometimes sexual bonds can be easily ended or cut off but emotional cheating and developing a strong (but inappropriate) relationship with someone is harder to break off.

that's always a catch 22 when you find something after you've snooped but 9 times out of 10 if you've snooped it's because your intuition tells you something ain't right.

rainshower 07-16-2009 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SarahMarie (Post 1029800)
I'm just curious. What do you guys consider to be cheating on a spouse? My friend is in complete denial that her husband is cheating on her. He has been trying to contact old girlfriends on Myspace to obtain nude pictures. I wouldn't put up with that from my husband. I suggested counseling. She's interested, but he is not.

Where do you draw the line with your SO?

to me, cheating is any deliberately discreet behavior, intention, or desire you share with or have for someone else that should be reserved only for your spouse, e.g., strong intimate thoughts and romantic feelings; intimate rendezvous at parks, the movies, or over lunch; holding hands and hugging; having contact via email, texting, vmail, phone calls, or messages sent through people; and of course having sexual contact.

having lunch with an old female friend from college is not cheating when the lunch arrangement is made known to your spouse with no issue.

having lunch with an old female friend from college who you had a serious relationship with that ended but left you both still carrying a torch for each other and wondering "what if?" is cheating ... especially when you plan lunch at a place in the next town over, and lie about your whereabouts while you are having lunch with her. big difference.

and i consider a husband who contacts old flames and asks for dirty pictures of them to be cheating and oogie.

MoppyT 07-16-2009 02:15 PM

Anything that involves contact with or solicitation of another live human (so not random porn) is completely unacceptable. Myspace, craigslist, whatever. It's all the same and no one should put up with it.

The New Black 07-16-2009 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josephine http://www.naturallycurly.com/curlta...s/viewpost.gif Generally, to me cheating is something you wouldn't do in front of the other person. And you know what is acceptable or unacceptable to that person.
Yes, this. And if it's something you wouldn't want your SO to do to you, that's wrong too.

curlyarca 07-16-2009 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by subbrock (Post 1029890)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Josephine (Post 1029874)

Generally, to me cheating is something you wouldn't do in front of the other person. And you know what is acceptable or unacceptable to that person. I'm one of those stricties.

thats how i see it too. if you wouldnt do it in front of my face, you sure as hell better not do it behind my back.

LOL

This is what I was thinking

MichelleBFT 07-16-2009 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by babywavy (Post 1029870)
That doesn't fall into my definition of cheating. Even if the actions did, the fact that she knows about it, tells me it's possible he isn't doing it behind her back, which would be what cheating is.

But I still say, it's pretty slimy

That she knows about it and isn't doing anything about it... to me, that makes it not cheating.

To me, cheating is getting sexual gratification behind your partner's back (there's a dirty joke in there somewhere but I'm sure it's inappropriate so I'll leave it alone), so perhaps this man's behavior was cheating before she found out about it and decided it was okay with her, but now? Nope.

Each couple has to define the parameters of their relationship for themselves. To some, looking at porn is cheating. Not to me. To some, going to a strip club is cheating. Not to me. To some, kissing isn't cheating. It sure as hell is to me.

I have a very strict look but don't interact policy. It does not apply to flirting.

Candycane 07-16-2009 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Residual (Post 1029805)
I think that's unacceptable and cheating. Perhaps I am "strict", I don't know.

There are some things that I don't know if I consider cheating per se, but I wouldn't tolerate for example going to strip clubs. Just one of my morals I suppose but if others are OK with it that's fine. But I get a lot of flak about that and how "all guys go so you will never find someone who doesn't" or "you're such a prude".

Omg i am the same way--I can not tolerate any man of mine going to a strip club--i consider it the same thing as any other chick putin her body all over my man-only worse because he is actually paying for it--people think im super prude but if u really think about it...

Res 07-16-2009 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xfoxelil1xx (Post 1030255)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Residual (Post 1029805)
I think that's unacceptable and cheating. Perhaps I am "strict", I don't know.

There are some things that I don't know if I consider cheating per se, but I wouldn't tolerate for example going to strip clubs. Just one of my morals I suppose but if others are OK with it that's fine. But I get a lot of flak about that and how "all guys go so you will never find someone who doesn't" or "you're such a prude".

Omg i am the same way--I can not tolerate any man of mine going to a strip club--i consider it the same thing as any other chick putin her body all over my man-only worse because he is actually paying for it--people think im super prude but if u really think about it...

We can be super prudes together. :toothy5::blob5:

But seriously, everyone has the right to be uncomfortable with something. As others in this thread have said it all the depends on the couple and what they define as cheating.

iara 07-16-2009 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MichelleBFT (Post 1030233)
Quote:

Originally Posted by babywavy (Post 1029870)
That doesn't fall into my definition of cheating. Even if the actions did, the fact that she knows about it, tells me it's possible he isn't doing it behind her back, which would be what cheating is.

But I still say, it's pretty slimy

That she knows about it and isn't doing anything about it... to me, that makes it not cheating.

To me, cheating is getting sexual gratification behind your partner's back {snip}

Maybe I missed where the OP said she was privy to his solicitations from the start. I thought he was trying to get sexual gratification behind her back...testing the waters with baby steps (i.e., asking for pictures). Then somehow she found out. Now she is trying to rationalize it and convince herself that he is not cheating so that she does not think she married a disrespectful, cheating jerk. Some people will try to believe anything than acknowledge they are being deceived.

Him refusing counseling makes me think he is the one convincing her it is not cheating. The issue is with her, the uncool wife, and not his actions.

To answer to OP, that is cheating to me. My definition is similar to what Rainshower and Josephine wrote.

Regardless of what we call it, that is a slimy thing to do.

au_naurale 07-16-2009 09:08 PM

I think, regardless of whether the spouse knows or not, that if your spouse is fooling around on you with anyone else, they are unfaithful. There are no loop holes, no excuses.. Granted, I wouldn't say it's technically cheating, as my definition of cheating only applies to affairs that take place behind said spouse's back. However, it is still unfaithful and I still consider it the same level of low as cheating. Personally, I would never take back anyone that cheated on me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rainshower (Post 1029917)
to me, cheating is any deliberately discreet behavior, intention, or desire you share with or have for someone else that should be reserved only for your spouse, e.g., strong intimate thoughts and romantic feelings; intimate rendezvous at parks, the movies, or over lunch; holding hands and hugging; having contact via email, texting, vmail, phone calls, or messages sent through people; and of course having sexual contact.

Actually, I agree with this. Although it is not directly cheating, I don't think there is anything faithful about fantasizing or thinking about any other person sexually unless of course, that person is your spouse. To me, marriage is all about complete and total devotion.

iara 07-16-2009 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by au_naurale (Post 1030387)
Although it is not directly cheating, I don't think there is anything faithful about fantasizing or thinking about any other person sexually unless of course, that person is your spouse. To me, marriage is all about complete and total devotion.

People fantasize about others everyday. That will not stop when you are married. You are married...not dead. As long as you do not act on it and it does not interfere negatively with your relationship with your SO, it is not being unfaithful, IMO.

As a teacher once said, "I may be diabetic, but that does not stop me from checking out the candy store."

SarahMarie 07-16-2009 09:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iara (Post 1030374)
Quote:

Originally Posted by MichelleBFT (Post 1030233)
Quote:

Originally Posted by babywavy (Post 1029870)
That doesn't fall into my definition of cheating. Even if the actions did, the fact that she knows about it, tells me it's possible he isn't doing it behind her back, which would be what cheating is.

But I still say, it's pretty slimy

That she knows about it and isn't doing anything about it... to me, that makes it not cheating.

To me, cheating is getting sexual gratification behind your partner's back {snip}

Maybe I missed where the OP said she was privy to his solicitations from the start. I thought he was trying to get sexual gratification behind her back...testing the waters with baby steps (i.e., asking for pictures). Then somehow she found out. Now she is trying to rationalize it and convince herself that he is not cheating so that she does not think she married a disrespectful, cheating jerk. Some people will try to believe anything than acknowledge they are being deceived.

Him refusing counseling makes me think he is the one convincing her it is not cheating. The issue is with her, the uncool wife, and not his actions.

To answer to OP, that is cheating to me. My definition is similar to what Rainshower and Josephine wrote.

Regardless of what we call it, that is a slimy thing to do.

Yeah, she married him thinking he was honest. I really don't think she knew until a few days ago when she called me. It's not like she let it go on knowingly. I do have a problem with her rationalizing it now.

au_naurale 07-16-2009 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iara (Post 1030396)
Quote:

Originally Posted by au_naurale (Post 1030387)
Although it is not directly cheating, I don't think there is anything faithful about fantasizing or thinking about any other person sexually unless of course, that person is your spouse. To me, marriage is all about complete and total devotion.

People fantasize about others everyday. That will not stop when you are married. You are married...not dead. As long as you do not act on it and it does not interfere negatively with your relationship with your SO, it is not being unfaithful, IMO.

As a teacher once said, "I may be diabetic, but that does not stop me from checking out the candy store."

Checking someone else out is different from sexually fantasizing about other people when you are with your spouse.

Lotsawaves 07-16-2009 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SarahMarie (Post 1029883)
Quote:

Originally Posted by burgundy_locks (Post 1029873)
that's crazy stuff. if i were you, i would stay out of it 100%. try to act like you never knew this detail. if she accepts this behavior, there is really not much you can do. you mentioned seeing a counselor, and if she doesnt, there is no point on wanting to help her if she is not willing to help herself. i've known of a very very similar story to this one. the woman said she knows that her husband goes online and probably lies to all those women but at the end of the day, he's not going to leave her. which i believe. i dont think i could live with this situation. but if she has accepted it- which she has because she doesnt confront the situation, it's best for you to get it out ur head. your probably more stressed about it than she is.

I am staying out of it. Other than talking to a professional, I don't know what else to tell her. There is nothing I can do. It doesn't involve me and could damage our friendship. Also, I don't want to tell her to do the wrong thing and end up being the one blamed for a failed marriage.

You are wise to stay out of it. She is the one who has to decide if she is willing to deal with this.

I definitely wouldn't. To me, he is really crossing the line. It looks to me that he is wanting to cheat. Apparently, he isn't happy in his current situation. She isn't either. It's up to her to decide what she wants to do about it. She may not do anything right now, but in time, she will probably have to make a big decision. Just be a sounding board for her without any advice, other than to seek professional help. If he doesn't want it, then she can do it for herself.

Gemini13 07-17-2009 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iara (Post 1030396)
Quote:

Originally Posted by au_naurale (Post 1030387)
Although it is not directly cheating, I don't think there is anything faithful about fantasizing or thinking about any other person sexually unless of course, that person is your spouse. To me, marriage is all about complete and total devotion.

People fantasize about others everyday. That will not stop when you are married. You are married...not dead. As long as you do not act on it and it does not interfere negatively with your relationship with your SO, it is not being unfaithful, IMO.

As a teacher once said, "I may be diabetic, but that does not stop me from checking out the candy store."

Agreed. I would feel pretty control-freakish if I told my husband he couldn't even think about other women like that. He is allowed ownership of his own mind. And I'd be really weirded out if he said that to me... But that, of course, is JMO.

Eternitycurls 07-17-2009 09:22 AM

SO and I have defined cheating as basically anything we would do with each other that we wouldn't do with our platonic same sex friends. So if he wouldn't do it with one of his guy friends then he can't do it with another girl.

With the OP's situation by our definition- pretty sure he wouldn't harrass a buddy for a naked pic. (unless..)

Amneris 07-17-2009 09:39 AM

I don't think pornography, strip clubs or viewing naked pictures are cheating necessarily, but they are extremely misogynistic behaviours that exploit women. I don't tolerate that from a man, not because I'm a prude or insecure but because it is sexist, uncouth behaviour and I cannot respect any man who engages in it. (I know some women have started doing these things too - I don't think it has the same impact in gender relations but I also don't approve of that - it degrades human sexuality IMO.)

I have to wonder at the responses these women are giving this man. I would like to see one of my exes TRY that with me!

I also think cheating can be anything you did that you wouldn't want your spouse to know, or that you do behind their back knowing they wouldn't approve. I don't necessarily think however that not telling your spouse something means you intend to deceive or hurt them. Sometimes things are not worth telling. ie. if an ex contacts you and you're not interested, or someone hits on you and you don't care, I don't believe in automatically running to your spouse and drumming up drama - I keep that stuff to myself. If somehow someone else found out that that happened, they might think I was hiding it and cheating, but I would disagree with that.

I'm also ambiguous on the idea of "emotional cheating." I think it is fine to have an emotional bond and share intimate conversation with friends of the same sex who are not your spouse, and even discuss your spouse with them, as long as the boundaries are clear. I don't think you always have to only tell your spouse everything. But I know some people consider that emotional cheating. So there are no clear definitions - I think if you're not respecting your spouse or your relationship and not considering their feelings, you may be cheating.

Amneris 07-17-2009 09:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gemini13 (Post 1030710)
Quote:

Originally Posted by iara (Post 1030396)
Quote:

Originally Posted by au_naurale (Post 1030387)
Although it is not directly cheating, I don't think there is anything faithful about fantasizing or thinking about any other person sexually unless of course, that person is your spouse. To me, marriage is all about complete and total devotion.

People fantasize about others everyday. That will not stop when you are married. You are married...not dead. As long as you do not act on it and it does not interfere negatively with your relationship with your SO, it is not being unfaithful, IMO.

As a teacher once said, "I may be diabetic, but that does not stop me from checking out the candy store."

Agreed. I would feel pretty control-freakish if I told my husband he couldn't even think about other women like that. He is allowed ownership of his own mind. And I'd be really weirded out if he said that to me... But that, of course, is JMO.

Au_naurale is only 19, and I think at 19, a lot of women have that very idealized and romanticized notion of marriage - and many 19 year old guys believe or know that too and will tell them things like that.

However, I think it is human nature to look at and fantasize about other people (yes, maybe even during sex.) I think the key is to keep it as a fantasy and not act on it or allow it to affect your real-life relationship. No one but you controls what goes on in your mind, or has the right to.

Gemini13 07-17-2009 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amneris (Post 1030777)
I don't necessarily think however that not telling your spouse something means you intend to deceive or hurt them. Sometimes things are not worth telling. ie. if an ex contacts you and you're not interested, or someone hits on you and you don't care, I don't believe in automatically running to your spouse and drumming up drama - I keep that stuff to myself. If somehow someone else found out that that happened, they might think I was hiding it and cheating, but I would disagree with that.

Yes, ITA! My husband has actually asked me not to tell him stuff like that, because it upsets him-especially if a guy was catcalling at me, or something.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amneris (Post 1030784)
Au_naurale is only 19, and I think at 19, a lot of women have that very idealized and romanticized notion of marriage - and many 19 year old guys believe or know that too and will tell them things like that.

Ah, that makes sense.

SarahMarie 07-17-2009 12:19 PM

I agree that it is normal to fantasize about other people. I don't consider that cheating, as long as it's just a fantasy and nobody acts on those thoughts. My friend's husband, however, took his fantasies a step further, in my opinion, when he asked women for nude photos. If he had just been fantasizing about other women with no further action, I would have told her that it would probably be asking too much to control his mind!


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