Biracial and Multiracial black people: Are those considered a race? - Page 2

frau · 08-06-2009, 11:08 AM

why does it seem that some people want to believe that being white means:
a, b and c

and being black means:
x, y and z

there are some whites that are:
a, g and r

some blacks that are:
b, c and z

i always feel like biracial people think that because they have a white or black or whatever parent it explains their difference. we're all different.

eta,
my post was not in response to any poster. it was just a thought that came into my head after reading the phrase, "deny my white parent..."

i just feel that the whole race thing is whack and we're all trying to make this whackness make sense. it never will because it's all a lie.

BekkaPoo · 08-06-2009, 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amneris

Oh yes, of course there are people who don't have any Black (or white) roots who call themselves mixed. But the OP was talking about being mixed with Black, so that's what I was addressing. And truly, this is made out as FAR more of an issue in the Black community than elsewhere. And incidentally, I've yet to hear white people discussing whether a person who is "half white" is white or not - it's a given that they're not. This is much more an issue for people of colour and Blacks in particular.

I don't find a discussion of other countries to be hair-splitting, since the OP mentioned discussions with people from Africa and I myself have roots in the Caribbean.

And yeah, we're all speaking for ourselves, which is totally cool...

Do you think that is because that's what you've been mostly exposed to? I've met mixed folks who had no black blood who've experienced racism from their respective cultures/races, for example a Japanese/white mixed person. This kind of "disowning" of mixed race people happens everywhere.

08-06-2009, 11:14 AM

Honestly...When it comes to race - the definitions shift depending upon the company and the purpose.

It's true that race is a social construct and not a biological one. Important: How you are defined socially by other people is usually based upon your appearance and unfortunately - it does directly impact your life.

Ugly but true: At the top of the racial pyramid are White people. Everyone else is non-White...so all of the conversation and debate about who is mixed..who is Black...who is (insert non-White word here) is really moot. At times, it's a discussion about how far away from (or how close to) White you are...I don't know...

We'll all make real progress when race doesn't matter, but that's a long way off.

These convos are difficult.

CocoaCoily · 08-06-2009, 11:26 AM

Race as a social construct, in and of itself, does not bother me. It's the attachment of some sort of value to greater or lesser degrees, that bothers me. It's obvious that there are different types of people in the world. I love our rainbow of colors, and yes, I DO see color.

So, it is in that respect, that I will teach my daughter that she Black and Polish, biracial for short is an acceptable alternative. If someone tries to refer to her as one or the other, they will be corrected.

BekkaPoo · 08-06-2009, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CocoaCoily

Race as a social construct, in and of itself, does not bother me. It's the attachment of some sort of value to greater or lesser degrees, that bothers me. It's obvious that there are different types of people in the world. I love our rainbow of colors, and yes, I DO see color.

So, it is in that respect, that I will teach my daughter that she Black and Polish, biracial for short is an acceptable alternative. If someone tries to refer to her as one or the other, they will be corrected.

Well said.. and ITA. I see color too, but then I love all colors.. I'm an artist.

gemini · 08-06-2009, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CocoaCoily

Race as a social construct, in and of itself, does not bother me. It's the attachment of some sort of value to greater or lesser degrees, that bothers me. It's obvious that there are different types of people in the world. I love our rainbow of colors, and yes, I DO see color.

So, it is in that respect, that I will teach my daughter that she Black and Polish, biracial for short is an acceptable alternative. If someone tries to refer to her as one or the other, they will be corrected.

I agree. I know that both black and white people will define me as only black, but just because I don't see myself as such does not mean it's a slight against black people. I'm still BOTH. I know that yes, according to the "rules" I am still seen as a black person regardless of my actual background. It's just a very complicated thing and as a whole, I feel race is just a small part of how I see myself, and I feel people in this country place way too much emphasis on race. We say we should judge people on content of their character, yet if there is a "first black ____" there is still this massive emphasis that the person is black, not on who they are as an individual.

And also, what I meant is not that the black community does not exist, but I don't think it's as prominent or cohesive as it used to be--and that is just a consequence of the changing times. When I see Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson pop up in front of the cameras at any opportunity when someone is asked to address "black" issues, I get annoyed; I don't feel that they represent me.

subbrock · 08-06-2009, 12:43 PM

i have the same feelings as those posters who have identified themselves as biracial or who have a biracial child.

i dont believe in the one drop rule. i refuse to keep alive the thoughts of white supremecists.

FieryCurls · 08-06-2009, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amneris

Oh yes, of course there are people who don't have any Black (or white) roots who call themselves mixed. But the OP was talking about being mixed with Black, so that's what I was addressing. And truly, this is made out as FAR more of an issue in the Black community than elsewhere. And incidentally, I've yet to hear white people discussing whether a person who is "half white" is white or not - it's a given that they're not. This is much more an issue for people of colour and Blacks in particular.

I don't find a discussion of other countries to be hair-splitting, since the OP mentioned discussions with people from Africa and I myself have roots in the Caribbean.

And yeah, we're all speaking for ourselves, which is totally cool...

My daughter is certainly "half white". She has a white mother...she has to be "half white".

gemini · 08-06-2009, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FieryCurls

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amneris

Oh yes, of course there are people who don't have any Black (or white) roots who call themselves mixed. But the OP was talking about being mixed with Black, so that's what I was addressing. And truly, this is made out as FAR more of an issue in the Black community than elsewhere. And incidentally, I've yet to hear white people discussing whether a person who is "half white" is white or not - it's a given that they're not. This is much more an issue for people of colour and Blacks in particular.

I don't find a discussion of other countries to be hair-splitting, since the OP mentioned discussions with people from Africa and I myself have roots in the Caribbean.

And yeah, we're all speaking for ourselves, which is totally cool...

My daughter is certainly "half white". She has a white mother...she has to be "half white".

She is so cute. She looks like the baby on your ticker.

KindredGhost1983 · 08-06-2009, 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FieryCurls;

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amneris;

Oh yes, of course there are people who don't have any Black (or white) roots who call themselves mixed. But the OP was talking about being mixed with Black, so that's what I was addressing. And truly, this is made out as FAR more of an issue in the Black community than elsewhere. And incidentally, I've yet to hear white people discussing whether a person who is "half white" is white or not - it's a given that they're not. This is much more an issue for people of colour and Blacks in particular.

I don't find a discussion of other countries to be hair-splitting, since the OP mentioned discussions with people from Africa and I myself have roots in the Caribbean.

And yeah, we're all speaking for ourselves, which is totally cool...

My daughter is certainly "half white". She has a white mother...she has to be "half white".

Awww! She's beautiful

FieryCurls · 08-06-2009, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gemini

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fierycurls

My daughter is certainly "half white". She has a white mother...she has to be "half white".

She is so cute. She looks like the baby on your ticker.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kindredspirit1983

Quote:

Originally Posted by FieryCurls

My daughter is certainly "half white". She has a white mother...she has to be "half white".

Awww! She's beautiful

Thanks. She's my cute little stinker

.

murrrcat · 08-06-2009, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kindredspirit1983

I choose to call myself biracial because I refuse to deny either parents contribution to my makeup. It would hurt my father to his core if I simply said I was Black. I've corrected people who have tried to insist I'm either black or white. I'm not black and I'm not white.

I have the hardest time understanding why some people have trouble with this. It's not dividing oneself into 'halves' it's acknowledging all areas of your racial makeup. I'm choosing to give credit where it is due.

me too!!! I remember one time some girl told me that well your not really white so just go by black, and then another girl told me that technically you're supposed to go by the race of your mother. Either way I want to go by both because I'm not going to call myself Black with out calling myself white because I love my mother and I will not deny her white blood that runs through my veins lmao.

but if you say your daughter is black and polish that kinda makes no sense because,then I'm black polish and german but i'm still black and white because my mother may be polish and german but she's still white, and I know black people from poland and germany and i know mixed kids who have parents who happen to be black and white, but from germany. Its kind of like your saying black people can't be from europe or something unless your referring to a black person who is polish but then why would you say black and polish?

frau · 08-06-2009, 01:58 PM

zoe kravitz, daughter of lenny kravitz and lisa bonet is...? can someone choose her identity? (don't cop out by saying she chooses, i'm trying to make a point that the whole claiming to be biracial is in itself is heavily buying into the racial construct)

nevermind, don't answer. there is nothing in this culture that allows you to be just who you are so just forget it.

continue...

KindredGhost1983 · 08-06-2009, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frau

zoe kravitz, daughter of lenny kravitz and lisa bonet is...? can someone choose her identity? (don't cop out by saying she chooses, i'm trying to make a point that the whole claiming to be biracial is in itself is heavily buying into the racial construct)

nevermind, don't answer. there is nothing in this culture that allows you to be just who you are so just forget it.

continue...

I remember you saying you would never post in one of these threads again

Dea · 08-06-2009, 02:18 PM

I wonder if race is social, then where is the benefit of going outside of the given categories by going "I'm black and white." Wouldn't it be more relevant to explaining how/why you're outside of the category by going "I'm African-American and Polish"? Explains more about yourself in a "I come from two cultures and celebrate both" kind of way. There is no "black" or "white" culture... Although in certain contexts, black or white seem to have fairly specific meanings.

Unless, you don't know your parent's culture/ there's just too much.

murrrcat · 08-06-2009, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dea

I wonder if race is social, then where is the benefit of going outside of the given categories by going "I'm black and white." Wouldn't it be more relevant to explaining how/why you're outside of the category by going "I'm African-American and Polish"? Explains more about yourself in a "I come from two cultures and celebrate both" kind of way. There is no "black" or "white" culture... Although in certain contexts, black or white seem to have fairly specific meanings.

Unless, you don't know your parent's culture/ there's just too much.

true, but when I explain which i have to often because people think I'm hawaiin or asian, anyway I usually say "i'm black and white...but my mother is german and polish" which still doesn't really explain why i look different but it usually ends the conversation. But black people can be from everywhere is what I'm saying like when you say "I'm black and polish and german" its like black people are only american. and then polish and german people are white. and the polish side of my family isn't even all that "white" its soo much crap I hate explaining myself lol i just want to be me.

murrrcat · 08-06-2009, 02:24 PM

and please take the word crap lightly.

CocoaCoily · 08-06-2009, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by turtles

but if you say your daughter is black and polish that kinda makes no sense because,then I'm black polish and german but i'm still black and white because my mother may be polish and german but she's still white, and I know black people from poland and germany and i know mixed kids who have parents who happen to be black and white, but from germany. Its kind of like your saying black people can't be from europe or something unless your referring to a black person who is polish but then why would you say black and polish?

Because that's what she is. If you ask my husband what he is (and people do, because he can pass for many things) he will tell you he is Polish. If you want to get technical, she's Belizean Polish. But, then she'd have to explain Belize is where Belizeans come from, that it is a country in Central America, blah blah blah, because not many people know of Belize. Hence, Black and Polish, or briacial for short. ETA: She could also say African Polish-American, which is how my mom sometimes refers to her.

And yes, Black people can be in Poland, but that is not necessarily their heritage. They would likely be African-Polish (or have the luxury of being able to claim a specific country in Africa to be really technical), similar to the way we here are African-American. And to further get technical, those Black people in Poland may not be Black Poles like my daughter, because they may not have a Polish blood line.

Quote:

Originally Posted by frau

zoe kravitz, daughter of lenny kravitz and lisa bonet is...? can someone choose her identity?

Since you ask, I would say that Zoe Kravitz is biracial, since she happens to come from two biracial parents with the same basic mix.

scrills · 08-06-2009, 02:35 PM

I didn't read all the posts, but I have found that people from other countries, especially Africa. I prefer not to have that conversation with my friends from Africa (or I pick and choose my battles)

And for the record, all Africans are not dark

Krayt · 08-06-2009, 03:11 PM

My opinion.

Though I do get annoyed when people who aren't fully something will simply say that they are. If you are a mix, say so, its pretty simple. I guess people like being associated with something.

Again, it doesn't matter...