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Old 10-20-2008, 03:31 PM   #81
 
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And Obama has claimed to be the second coming of Moses? Has Obama claimed to be anything other than who he is? Whatever.
Well I guess I was the only one rolling my eyes at his speech when he accepted the nomination. " this was the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow and our planet began to heal" I'm sorry I can't stomach new age nonsense and hopi indian proverbs from political candidates.
I guess he would have scored higher if he had winked and blown kisses during his speech.
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Old 10-20-2008, 05:09 PM   #82
 
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You know, I've started to respond to you 3 times, read your signature again and again and decided not to.
Well, just because she is a Republican doesn't mean she wasn't interested in an honest answer.

I agree with Micelle's response and would add that it seems to be human nature to fear and thus hate anything that is different than yourself. It's something that needs continual work.
So somehow my signature makes me a racist. Gotcha. Wow, okay.
Hey, I was defending you there, not accusing you of being a racist. I mentioned your party affiliation to point out to Springcurl that being a member of the opposing party doesn't negate other questions.
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Old 10-20-2008, 05:33 PM   #83
 
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Not directed towards anyone in particular, just an observation:

Are we going to start whining about people's quotes in their sig's now? Cry me a river. I've seen plenty of them around here I don't agree with but, come on! I think this might be an occasion for "big girl panties".

And I guess "off-putting" is in the eye of the beholder.
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Old 10-20-2008, 05:37 PM   #84
 
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Not directed towards anyone in particular, just an observation:

Are we going to start whining about people's quotes in their sig's now? Cry me a river. I've seen plenty of them around here I don't agree with but, come on! I think this might be an occasion for "big girl panties".

And I guess "off-putting" is in the eye of the beholder.
Oh hey, I still owe you a drink.


I enjoy the varying siggies. I really disagree with some of them, but, so what? We're all free to put whatever we like (within reason) in them. I still smile at yours, even if I am the enemy.
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Old 10-20-2008, 05:44 PM   #85
 
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Not directed towards anyone in particular, just an observation:

Are we going to start whining about people's quotes in their sig's now? Cry me a river. I've seen plenty of them around here I don't agree with but, come on! I think this might be an occasion for "big girl panties".

And I guess "off-putting" is in the eye of the beholder.
Oh hey, I still owe you a drink.


I enjoy the varying siggies. I really disagree with some of them, but, so what? We're all free to put whatever we like (within reason) in them. I still smile at yours, even if I am the enemy.
Hey, about that drink! I didn't want to be the one to remind you but since you brought it up....

You know RCC, I really like you. For a Lib, you're not bad at all.

I enjoy your posts. You are thoughtful and kind and snarky when you need to be. Don't ever change!
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Old 10-20-2008, 07:29 PM   #86
 
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Well I guess I was the only one rolling my eyes at his speech when he accepted the nomination. " this was the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow and our planet began to heal" I'm sorry I can't stomach new age nonsense and hopi indian proverbs from political candidates.
hmmmm. Not sure which Hopi proverb you're referring to, but what's wrong with Hopi proverbs....? Hopi proverbs are full of wisdom. Is there something wrong with...wisdom?
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Old 10-20-2008, 07:31 PM   #87
 
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Well I guess I was the only one rolling my eyes at his speech when he accepted the nomination. " this was the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow and our planet began to heal" I'm sorry I can't stomach new age nonsense and hopi indian proverbs from political candidates.
hmmmm. Not sure which Hopi proverb you're referring to, but what's wrong with Hopi proverbs....? Hopi proverbs are full of wisdom. Is there something wrong with...wisdom?
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Old 10-20-2008, 07:33 PM   #88
 
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Old 10-20-2008, 08:55 PM   #89
 
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I was thinking about this subject this past weekend. Where do you ladies think racism comes from? I honestly think it's fear, I'm not trying to justify it AT ALL by saying that, but I think the root cause of racism is fear. I think that's why certain races decided they were better than others because they feared them.


Eh..."root cause"? I have a hard time believing that colonial-era white folks enslaved an entire race of people for 400 years because they feared them.

I think it's more a matter of simply not liking them. It's quite a common human response to dislike things that are different or unknown.
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Old 10-21-2008, 07:12 AM   #90
 
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Well, just because she is a Republican doesn't mean she wasn't interested in an honest answer.

I agree with Micelle's response and would add that it seems to be human nature to fear and thus hate anything that is different than yourself. It's something that needs continual work.
So somehow my signature makes me a racist. Gotcha. Wow, okay.
Hey, I was defending you there, not accusing you of being a racist. I mentioned your party affiliation to point out to Springcurl that being a member of the opposing party doesn't negate other questions.
Sorry I quoted your post instead of Springcurls. It was the last one I read before I made my comment, my statement wasn't directed at you. And I've seen the whole signature thing come up before and people being "offended" by others. I'm going to steal two of RCW's lines "put your big girl panties on" and "just put me on ignore." There have certainly been signatures I haven't liked and haven't agreed with, but I know whose they are and I don't pay attention to them. I'm a truly believe that everyone is entitled to their opinion, and even if I don't agree with it, it doesn't make them wrong and me right, it means we have different opinions, simple as that. That's the great thing about this country, we have freedom of speech.
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Old 10-21-2008, 08:23 AM   #91
 
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I was thinking about this subject this past weekend. Where do you ladies think racism comes from? I honestly think it's fear, I'm not trying to justify it AT ALL by saying that, but I think the root cause of racism is fear. I think that's why certain races decided they were better than others because they feared them.


Eh..."root cause"? I have a hard time believing that colonial-era white folks enslaved an entire race of people for 400 years because they feared them.

I think it's more a matter of simply not liking them. It's quite a common human response to dislike things that are different or unknown.
i think its "root cause" was the need to justify oppression and domination. at first, during early colonial times, there was no such a thing as a lifelong slave. you were an indentured servant for a period of time, whether you were white, black or indian. they worked together, intermarried and ran away together. gradually, slavery became a life sentence, something you were born into. and slave and african became synonymous. africans were seen as subhuman; by law they were only considered 3/5 of a person.
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Old 10-21-2008, 10:15 AM   #92
 
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I was thinking about this subject this past weekend. Where do you ladies think racism comes from? I honestly think it's fear, I'm not trying to justify it AT ALL by saying that, but I think the root cause of racism is fear. I think that's why certain races decided they were better than others because they feared them.


Eh..."root cause"? I have a hard time believing that colonial-era white folks enslaved an entire race of people for 400 years because they feared them.

I think it's more a matter of simply not liking them. It's quite a common human response to dislike things that are different or unknown.
Fear doesn't make you invade someone's territory, round them up and kidnap them and sell them as slaves. I would call that greed. Greed with some sadism thrown in.
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Old 10-21-2008, 01:40 PM   #93
 
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Fear doesn't make you invade someone's territory, round them up and kidnap them and sell them as slaves. I would call that greed. Greed with some sadism thrown in.

I agree... Think about it... When the colonials came over and took the land from the Indians, they didn't fear them. The English had guns, the Indians didn't. They considered them an inferior race because they were different: they didn't speak the language, they had different "savage" (i prefer the word simple) ways. They said, "Well lookey what we got here. A bunch of injuns who don't speak english. Let's shake hands and tell them we're giving them better land, make them sign contracts they can't read and then force them to walk a million miles in the cold to move off the land they've occupied for centuries. What are they gonna do? Send up a smoke signal on us?"

Greed and an attitude of superiority to that which is different, I believe, are the root of racism.
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Old 10-21-2008, 01:58 PM   #94
 
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I remember learning that -isms are fear-based.
Although simplistic, I think that could explain some people's -isms. A lust for power/money could explain other people's -isms. I do think it can be perpetuated by fear.
Sure, the slaveowner had slaves, not out of fear, but for power/money. However, the slaveowner might tell his daughters to be careful of those "savage" slaves that they are dangerous and that daddy is trying to civilize them.
I can definitely see how fear can motivate people to not change the status quo even if what they see is wrong. Daddy beating a slave just is inherently wrong...but daddy beating a slave to "teach" him...well, maybe that's okay.

Using illegal immigrants by giving them jobs in harsh conditions and not paying enough is money/power-driven...but telling others that they are taking over jobs is fear-driven. As long as there is an under-ground of illegal work, then citizens can be ignorant of it and think their jobs are intact. If illegal immigrants actually were allowed to work on a more competitive basis, then fear would take over.
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Old 10-21-2008, 01:59 PM   #95
 
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Fear doesn't make you invade someone's territory, round them up and kidnap them and sell them as slaves. I would call that greed. Greed with some sadism thrown in.

I agree... Think about it... When the colonials came over and took the land from the Indians, they didn't fear them. The English had guns, the Indians didn't. They considered them an inferior race because they were different: they didn't speak the language, they had different "savage" (i prefer the word simple) ways. They said, "Well lookey what we got here. A bunch of injuns who don't speak english. Let's shake hands and tell them we're giving them better land, make them sign contracts they can't read and then force them to walk a million miles in the cold to move off the land they've occupied for centuries. What are they gonna do? Send up a smoke signal on us?"

Greed and an attitude of superiority to that which is different, I believe, are the root of racism.
However, to perpetuate racism among others, stories of them being savages and invoking fear sure helped.
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Old 10-21-2008, 08:32 PM   #96
 
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I remember learning that -isms are fear-based.
Although simplistic, I think that could explain some people's -isms. A lust for power/money could explain other people's -isms. I do think it can be perpetuated by fear.
Sure, the slaveowner had slaves, not out of fear, but for power/money. However, the slaveowner might tell his daughters to be careful of those "savage" slaves that they are dangerous and that daddy is trying to civilize them.
I can definitely see how fear can motivate people to not change the status quo even if what they see is wrong. Daddy beating a slave just is inherently wrong...but daddy beating a slave to "teach" him...well, maybe that's okay.

Using illegal immigrants by giving them jobs in harsh conditions and not paying enough is money/power-driven...but telling others that they are taking over jobs is fear-driven. As long as there is an under-ground of illegal work, then citizens can be ignorant of it and think their jobs are intact. If illegal immigrants actually were allowed to work on a more competitive basis, then fear would take over.
well put.
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