Conservatives: give me something to chew on.

I'm a moderate with a lean towards liberal (with social issues -- I'm pro-gay marriage, pro-choice, for women's rights, for minority rights, health-care reform, etc.). Fiscally, I could go either way. I see merits in cutting spending, but I also see merits in helping out those who need a little extra help. I see war as sometimes a necessary evil in order to defend ourselves. I think we need to think long and hard before engaging in any war with any country. However, I'm conservative in that I have no problems with people owning guns (with some restrictions though) and I am for the death penalty (but only in extreme situations). I have nothing against public displays of religious symbols (as long as other religions are not being denied). A manger scene in front of the court house wouldn't bother me. If I found out that Jews wanted to put up the star of David for Hannukah and it was denied, then it would bother me that the manger scene was up.

Pretty much all my family is conservative (except my brother's wife but she's pro-life) and 3/4ths of my friends are conservative. I'm from Texas, so there you go. Most of my co-workers are liberal, though. But I'm in a "liberal" field, so to speak. I live in a region of Texas that is what I would call "conservative democrat."

I don't want a debate, but I feel confused and I feel like I'm missing something. What made you decide to develop a more politically conservative point of view? Without bashing liberals (and if liberals get involved in this, please don't bash conservatives...I really want to hear what they have to say), please share with me any "arguments" that made you decide "yes, this is why I believe what I believe." Give me something to chew on.

Thanks.
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3a/3b
I'm honestly not talking about anyone in particular here... But I wouldn't turn to a message board for serious political analysis
I'm honestly not talking about anyone in particular here... But I wouldn't turn to a message board for serious political analysis
Originally Posted by Eilonwy
I think we are all just here for a discussion.
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I don't want a political analysis.
I guess I just want to hear why one decides to be republican or conservative.
It would help me understand things in my life a little more...my friends/family and why after there was this passion for Obama, the country is starting to lean more conservative again.
Just curiosity.
No one has to respond if they don't want to. Or PM me if you'd rather. I don't want to engage in any lengthy debate on my inbox either. I truly just want to hear some conservative perspective of why they are conservative.

Thanks,
Boomygrrl
That's right, I said it! I wear scrunchies!!

I am a sulfate washing, cone slabbing, curly lovin' s.o.b. The CG police haven't caught me yet.


3a/3b
Here's a link to an article I generally agree with.

http://townhall.com/columnists/JohnH...a_conservative

Hope this helps.

Here's a link to an article I generally agree with.

http://townhall.com/columnists/JohnH...a_conservative

Hope this helps.
Originally Posted by Kitschy
Kitschy, you beat me to it. I read his column a couple of times a year to sort out certain thoughts and feelings and think yep, I'm still a conservative.

And his bit about, I would prefer the government forget about me surely rings true! Let me be a success or failure on my own, but give me the environment where I can do so!
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Thanks Kitschy, I'm going to look at it now.
That's right, I said it! I wear scrunchies!!

I am a sulfate washing, cone slabbing, curly lovin' s.o.b. The CG police haven't caught me yet.


3a/3b
I believe women and men are different, should be treated differently, and are not interchangeable. There are jobs women tend to be better at than men and vice-versa. There are ways a man behaves that women shouldn't behave in and vice-versa.
Now, what in the hell does that mean?...
CG since 07/26/09
I believe women and men are different, should be treated differently, and are not interchangeable. There are jobs women tend to be better at than men and vice-versa. There are ways a man behaves that women shouldn't behave in and vice-versa.
Now, what in the hell does that mean?...
Originally Posted by mandatoryfun
That he's a horrible person
I believe women and men are different, should be treated differently, and are not interchangeable. There are jobs women tend to be better at than men and vice-versa. There are ways a man behaves that women shouldn't behave in and vice-versa.
Now, what in the hell does that mean?...
Originally Posted by mandatoryfun
That he's a horrible person
Originally Posted by Eilonwy
Lol, more that he has completely traditional views about how women should behave versus how men should. Traditional views on gender are the reason women and gays will never be treated equally: they don't always behave the way they are "supposed" to.

Thanks for posting that link. It reaffirms that (and why) I am a socially liberal person.
I believe women and men are different, should be treated differently, and are not interchangeable. There are jobs women tend to be better at than men and vice-versa. There are ways a man behaves that women shouldn't behave in and vice-versa.
Now, what in the hell does that mean?...
Originally Posted by mandatoryfun

You know what it means. Now don't go getting uppity...
Lol, more that he has completely traditional views about how women should behave versus how men should.
Originally Posted by *LC*
That's what I meant by "horrible person."

Okay, I read that article. There are a couple of bullet points there that are libertarian, and there's the ridiculous misogynistic/misandristic bullet point. The rest are just risible rah-rah jingoism and complacency. Thinking that the US is literally the best nation on earth has nothing to do with political conservatism. It's just xenophobia and ignorance.

Last edited by Eilonwy; 02-20-2010 at 01:03 PM.
Lol, more that he has completely traditional views about how women should behave versus how men should.
Originally Posted by *LC*
That's what I meant by "horrible person."

Okay, I read that article. There are a couple of bullet points there that are libertarian, and there's the ridiculous misogynistic/misandristic bullet point. The rest are just risible rah-rah jingoism and complacency. Thinking that the US is literally the best nation on earth has nothing to do with political conservatism. It's just xenophobia and ignorance.
Originally Posted by Eilonwy
That article is full of stereotypes and talking points. There isn't much of substance.

For example, I don't think that vegetarianism or veganism is necessarily a part of the liberal or progressive ideology. Most of the people who do hold those values tend to be liberal, but it's not the same thing as saying it's a liberal value.

Like most conservatives, it seems that this guy exalts the Constitution, but doesn't really get into the nitty-gritty of what that means. I found his views overly simplistic and at times contradictory. But, I guess a lot of that has to do with the structure of the article.

...or not.
CG since 07/26/09
Interesting link. I read some of the other authors from the townhall website as well.
There is some sexism and xenophobia in there, for sure. I do understand the fiscal conservative side of the arguments though.
I guess that's where I'm stuck.
I'm all for our citizens having equal rights and for us to be responsible citizens. I'd actually like to see minimum government in our daily lives (stay out of our bedrooms, please). I'd like to see programs cut that do not work or have shown to be harming us (of course, all of these are debatable...there better be unbiased studies here). I want to see our national debt become smaller or to actually be balanced, like Clinton did.
I don't understand why conservatives blame liberals, when much of the problems were due to conservatives engaging in what is stereotypically known as liberal spending but for conservative causes. Now that we have a liberal in the white house, now we have to have panic and fear about spending? Where was this panic and fear before?

It's almost like conservatives decide to spend spend spend so that when a liberal takes office, they call out the liberal for not being fiscally conservative enough...maybe that's their way of ensuring that socially liberal programs do not get much of a chance. I don't know.

I'm not trying to bash conservatives. I'm trying to understand why there is so much panic. Clinton did a good job of balancing the budget. It almost seems like conservatives say they are fiscally conservative but they are not.
I'd rather be part of a party who is for equal rights, who wants to help the down-trodden and spends a lot of money than for a party who isn't for equal rights, who wants to help out the rich and spends a lot of money.
It becomes the lesser of two evils, in my mind.

I used to call myself socially liberal but fiscally conservative. Perhaps something like that can only exist in an ideal world. I understand that helping the downtrodden is going to take money. Health care reform is going to take money. If we can find a way to make sure that it ends up making money in the long run, then it will be worth it.

I agree the budget needs to be balanced. It needed to before we foolishly got involved over our heads with two wars (one of which didn't need to happen).
Why weren't conservatives yelling at Bush? Why is this now becoming an issue? Now?
We have our first black president and I think that has caused some of those on the extreme right to go bonkers. I do think some people are taking legitimate arguments about our economy and now yelling at him about it. Where was the anger before? We have a financial crisis and yes, I agree Obama needs to handle it better. He does.

I think both parties have acted irresponsibly. Something does need to be done. Unfortunately, the townhall, the tea party people think conservative politicians can handle this better. Where's the evidence?
That's right, I said it! I wear scrunchies!!

I am a sulfate washing, cone slabbing, curly lovin' s.o.b. The CG police haven't caught me yet.


3a/3b

Last edited by Boomygrrl; 02-20-2010 at 01:28 PM.
I will bookmark this link and read more later.
Any other links of interest?
That's right, I said it! I wear scrunchies!!

I am a sulfate washing, cone slabbing, curly lovin' s.o.b. The CG police haven't caught me yet.


3a/3b
Boomy, sounds like you've kind of made up your own mind on this one.

I tend to agree with you: I don't see anything terrible about conservative ideals in particular, but they have been practiced differently than they appear on paper.

Instead of keeping government out of people's lives, the Republican party interferes by helping out the rich, increasing income inequality and poverty and destabilizing our economy.

The Republican party interferes by denying people of color, women and homosexuals necessary rights and protections. Of course, they all have some libertarian sense of "equality," but ignores that certain groups require extra protections due to entrenched, ingrained prejudices.

Instead of responsible spending and small government, Republicans have run up the national debt. They want it all, but they don't want to pay for it. If you think Bush was bad, take a look at Regan, poster child for the modern conservative movement—he tripled national debt during his time in office.

Republicans claim to respect the Constitution and the beliefs of the Founding Fathers. But they'll completely disregard the Constitution if they feel it's necessary. What was that Bush 43 had said about the Constitution—"it's just a piece of paper"? But we can ignore all the signing statements, the executive privilege. And let's just try and forget that Reagan and Bush 43 both basically committed high treason.

Maybe the modern Republican party has evolved beyond traditional conservative values. Many conservatives I know believe that to be the case. But it doesn't explain why so many conservatives, including many posters on this board, continue to support this party.
CG since 07/26/09
Dear Mr. President:
During my shift in the Emergency Room last night, I had the pleasure of evaluating a patient whose smile revealed an expensive shiny gold tooth, whose body was adorned with a wide assortment of elaborate and costly tattoos, who wore a very expensive brand of tennis shoes and who chatted on a new cellular telephone equipped with a popular R&B ringtone.
While glancing over her patient chart, I happened to notice that her payer status was listed as “Medicaid”! During my examination of her, the patient informed me that she smokes more than one costly pack of cigarettes every day and somehow still has money to buy pretzels and beer.
And, you and our Congress expect me to pay for this woman’s health care? I contend that our nation’s “health care crisis” is not the result of a shortage of quality hospitals, doctors or nurses. Rather, it is the result of a “crisis of culture”, a culture in which it is perfectly acceptable to spend money on luxuries and vices while refusing to take care of one’s self or, heaven forbid, purchase health insurance. It is a culture based in the irresponsible credo that “I can do whatever I want to because someone else will always take care of me”.
Once you fix this “culture crisis” that rewards irresponsibility and dependency, you’ll be amazed at how quickly our nation’s health care difficulties will disappear.
Respectfully,
STARNER JONES, MD


Snopes agrees this is authentic.

Boomy, it sounds to me like you're a centrist. I think people tend to have weird ideas about centrist, like they haven't made up their minds or something. But you have made up your mind. And there's no need to adhere to a party line.

Like most conservatives, it seems that this guy exalts the Constitution, but doesn't really get into the nitty-gritty of what that means. I found his views overly simplistic and at times contradictory. But, I guess a lot of that has to do with the structure of the article.
Originally Posted by mandatoryfun
Even 200 years ago, before the dawn of post-modern criticism and semiotics, our Supreme Court recognized that the Constitution doesn't have meaning until it's given meaning through interpretation.
Dear Mr. President:
During my shift in the Emergency Room last night, I had the pleasure of evaluating a patient whose smile revealed an expensive shiny gold tooth, whose body was adorned with a wide assortment of elaborate and costly tattoos, who wore a very expensive brand of tennis shoes and who chatted on a new cellular telephone equipped with a popular R&B ringtone.
While glancing over her patient chart, I happened to notice that her payer status was listed as “Medicaid”! During my examination of her, the patient informed me that she smokes more than one costly pack of cigarettes every day and somehow still has money to buy pretzels and beer.
And, you and our Congress expect me to pay for this woman’s health care? I contend that our nation’s “health care crisis” is not the result of a shortage of quality hospitals, doctors or nurses. Rather, it is the result of a “crisis of culture”, a culture in which it is perfectly acceptable to spend money on luxuries and vices while refusing to take care of one’s self or, heaven forbid, purchase health insurance. It is a culture based in the irresponsible credo that “I can do whatever I want to because someone else will always take care of me”.
Once you fix this “culture crisis” that rewards irresponsibility and dependency, you’ll be amazed at how quickly our nation’s health care difficulties will disappear.
Respectfully,
STARNER JONES, MD


Snopes agrees this is authentic.
Originally Posted by Kitschy


Sounds like Dr. Starner Jones took a page right out of Saint Ronald Reagan's playbook: How to hoodwink the American people by playing the Welfare Queen card.

It's inflammatory, and not helpful.
My dad's a doctor. He's very conservative economically, and literally hates poor people. Yes, really. I know that sounds stupid, but it's seriously not an exaggeration. He grew up very poor, and has terrible self-esteem. His bigotry against poor people is projected self-hatred.

But as a doctor, he hates insurance companies even more than he hates poor people. He hates having to spend hours on the phone arguing with insurance providers, trying to convince them to cover a patient's medication. So he actually hates the current healthcare plan because it doesn't go far enough, and gives too many concessions to the insurance companies.


I feel I should add that my dad didn't discuss politics at all with me until I was 20 or 21 years old. My own political ideas had already formed at that point. I wasn't just reacting against him.

Last edited by Eilonwy; 02-20-2010 at 02:44 PM.

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