Uh? Hello? Jessicurl HCC protein free or not?

So like, I just noticed this forum. Obviously it's new. I feel sorta dorky but whatever.

I was told by folks here that hydrolyzed oat flour is considered a protein, however when I emailed Jessicurl about it they stated it is a thickener, and maintained that it is not a protein.

I love JC HCC, it's really and truly the best no poo product I've tried (and I've tried 'em all...), but I used it only sparingly because my hair HATES protein. HATES it. I would really and truly prefer to use HCC because I love it, but if the hydrolyzed oat flour is actually a protein, then forget it.

Can anyone clear this issue up for me?
Medium texture, normal-high porosity, wavy-curly 2c to 3a-ish hair that is MOISTURE HUNGRY!!!
Currently recovering from a protein hair crisis. My hair hates protein, apparently.

I always thought anything hydrolyzed means it's a protein.

I found a thread regarding whether hydrolyzed oat in the Too Shea is a protein or not. Maybe it will help to shed some light on it for you.

HTH
3a (protein sensitive)
Fine, normal porosity, normal elasticity



Cleansers: Mop-C Hydrating Shampoo, JCGLS
Conditioners: CJCR, CK Renew
Leave-in: CJCR, CJ Smoothing LI, CK Satin Roots
Stylers: HEBE, CJPP
Deep Conditioner: CJCR
Standby items:GVP K-Pak
Sooooo.... your hair loves the HCC?

I've used protein treatments that have either had no effect on my hair, or make it feel brittle afterward.
Meanwhile, I use the Jessicurl Too! Shea as a leave-in and my hair looks and feels great.

So am I protein-sensitive or not? I have no clue... I can't even tell if my hair is porous or not. (Pretty sure it's not very porous... I think.)

This stuff is CG, it's natural... Does it matter to me the definition of an ingredient or the chemistry behind it?
Naaahh... It works. That's all that matters.

"Sometimes I lie awake at night, and I ask, 'Where have I gone wrong?' Then a voice says to me, 'This is going to take more than one night.' "
- Charlie Brown
HEY!!! Follow me at http://www.twitter.com/kurleeedna
Hydrolized oat flour is a protein. All grain flours contain protein (think of gluten sensitive folks). It can be used as a protein, or as a thickener (think flour in gravy) and it isn't high enough to function as a damage repair ingredient like it would if it were higher up.

But, using an ingredient for a certain purpose doesn't really mean that the nature of the ingredient has changed.

That being said, if your hair tolerates the HCC, then use it. The protein amount may be small enough so that you don't notice it. I do notice it in the TooShea, other protein sensitive people don't.
Kiva! Microfinance works.

Med/Coarse, porous curly.
RCC!! I can always count on you to be my protein expert.

I'm scared to use the HCC regularly (I never did) for fear that my hair would freak out again. My hair never freaked with irregular use, so maybe that's the key. What irks me here is that Jessicurl doesn't seem to understand their own ingredients. You'd think they would be more knowledgeable, but well...there you go.

Kurlee Edna, I'm not sure if my hair "loves" it, but I like it, does that make sense? My hair doesn't play well with protein. Suave Naturals coconut has too much protein in it for me to use, for a reference. I have to be really careful, because I've been burned twice by protein usage, and I DON'T wanna go there a third time, LOL. Twice was enough. Ack!
Medium texture, normal-high porosity, wavy-curly 2c to 3a-ish hair that is MOISTURE HUNGRY!!!
Currently recovering from a protein hair crisis. My hair hates protein, apparently.

hydrolyzed oat flour is not a protein (at least not in the sense that silk amino acids, or hydrolyzed wheat are). It is used as thickener, viscosity stabilizer. It's hydrolyzed meaning broken down into smaller pieces using water. It has protein, like lots of grain ingredients, but it's doesn't have the power to be a protein like those in damaged hair conditioners

Last edited by coilynapp; 05-30-2010 at 03:44 PM.
OK, Finch... I couldn't tell by your post if your hair reacted well to it or not. Maybe you should stay away from it for a while, then try it again later to see what happens.

CoilyNapp - Your explanation of the hydrolyzed oat flour not actually being a protein, but having a protein, could be why my hair doesn't react badly to the Too! Shea.

(Either that or I'm not protein-sensitive...?)

Someday, I'll figure out my hair...

"Sometimes I lie awake at night, and I ask, 'Where have I gone wrong?' Then a voice says to me, 'This is going to take more than one night.' "
- Charlie Brown
HEY!!! Follow me at http://www.twitter.com/kurleeedna
hydrolyzed oat flour is not a protein (at least not in the sense that silk amino acids, or hydrolyzed wheat are). It is used as thickener, viscosity stabilizer. It's hydrolyzed meaning broken down into smaller pieces using water. It has protein, like lots of grain ingredients, but it's doesn't have the power to be a protein like those in damaged hair conditioners
Originally Posted by coilynapp
It does, but most products don't have it that high up.

I did see one reconstructor that was all grass and grain proteins, oats among them. I wish I could find it; it was an obscure item.

When I use TooShea, it feels like protein.

KurleeEdna, the oats are far down on the TooShea, so it may just be at a tolerable level, or the other ingredients are moisturizing enough to cancel out the small protein effects.
Kiva! Microfinance works.

Med/Coarse, porous curly.
hydrolyzed oats and hydrolyzed oat flour are different forms of the same thing--oats. All grains have protein. Oat flour has 14% protein. More likely the reconstructor had hydrolyzed oats rather than oat flour. In cosmetics, H. oat flour is not used in high amounts because it's mainly used for thickening

From http://theherbarie.com/VenaSilk-pr-61.html

INCI: Hydrolyzed Oat Flour

VenaSilk™ is naturally derived from oat flour and contains 10% Oat Beta Glucans. VenaSilk™ is a trademark of The Herbarie. New Packaging!
VenaSilk™ provides unique characteristics to hair and skin care formulations. In skin care, VenaSilk™ imparts a luxurious emolliency and silky feel to lotions and creams and also provides added stability and viscosity. In hair care, VenaSilk™ provides surfactant based systems with stability and a silky, clean feel. VenaSilk™ can be used with GuarSilk™, GuarThix™, and XanThix™, for synergistic thickening and extra body building in hair care products.


ETA: also remember hyrolyzed doesn't automatically mean protein. It means broken down into smaller by undergoing hyrdolysis

Last edited by coilynapp; 06-01-2010 at 12:56 PM.
Ditto to what coilynapp said...

Not all proteins behave the same because it depends on their molecular size. Oat protein is pretty large and is more of a film-former/moisturizing protein than other proteins (ex: keratin). Hydrolyzed oat flour contains protein (it's not JUST protein), but the molecules are too big to penetrate the hair. It literally looks like flour. Its use in hair care is mainly as a thickener, emulsion stabilizer, irritant reduction, and sometimes as a volume booster. In shampoo it also enhances the cleansing ability of the formulation. In skin care it is used for its cushiony feel and its ability to retain moisture. It also is soothing to irritated or sunburned skin.

Hydrolyzed Oat Protein is more of what y'all think of when you are thinking protein. It has been cleaved into smaller particles than oat flour. This protein is also a film-former and is an excellent moisturizer and has some humectant properties.

Having said all that, and even though the oat flour in the JC product might not be a significant source of protein, I still wouldn't consider it "protein-free."

Hope that helps in some way.
FIA: 2cFii

Lady Crispina, Confector of Pharmaceutria and Conjurer of Exquisitus JuJu, in the Order of the Curly Crusaders

Last edited by runnerchicki; 06-07-2010 at 07:08 PM.
Ditto to what coilynapp said...

Not all proteins behave the same because it depends on their molecular size. Oat protein is pretty large and is more of a film-former/moisturizing protein than other proteins (ex: keratin). Hydrolyzed oat flour contains protein (it's not JUST protein), but the molecules are too big to penetrate the hair. It literally looks like flour. Its use in hair care is mainly as a thickener, emulsion stabilizer, irritant reduction, and sometimes as a volume booster. In shampoo it also enhances the cleansing ability of the formulation. In skin care it is used for its cushiony feel and its ability to retain moisture. It also is soothing to irritated or sunburned skin.

Hydrolyzed Oat Protein is more of what y'all think of when you are thinking protein. It has been cleaved into smaller particles than oat flour. This protein is also a film-former and is an excellent moisturizer and has some humectant properties.

Having said all that, and even though the oat flour in the JC product might not be a significant source of protein, I still wouldn't consider it "protein-free."

Hope that helps in some way.
Originally Posted by runnerchicki
I would call it low-protein.

I remember it being one of the early things I tried in my first six months here. People kept saying that it was protein free, but my hair would have that typical protein feel, which feel a lot different than just dry. it drove me nuts, lol.
Kiva! Microfinance works.

Med/Coarse, porous curly.

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