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-   -   An ATM card under your skin??(

ScaryCurl 11-26-2003 11:42 PM

An ATM card under your skin??
I came across this article and feel pretty uneasy about it. I feel that it crosses the line of privacy. How do you all feel about this? Would you allow yourself to be "chipped?" Why or why not?

An ATM card under your skin

Company pushes chip implants as ID alternative

Nov. 25 — Radio frequency identification tags aren’t just for pallets of goods in supermarkets anymore. Applied Digital Solutions (ADS) of Palm Beach, Fla., is hoping that Americans can be persuaded to implant RFID chips under their skin to identify themselves when going to a cash machine or in place of using a credit card.

THE SURGICAL PROCEDURE, which is performed with local anesthetic, embeds a 12-by-2.1mm RFID tag in the flesh of a human arm. ADS Chief Executive Scott Silverman, in a speech at the ID World 2003 conference in Paris last Friday, said his company had developed a “VeriPay” RFID technology and was hoping to find partners in financial services firms.

Matthew Cossolotto, a spokesman for ADS who says he’s been “chipped,” argues that competing proposals to embed RFID tags in key fobs or cards were flawed. “If you lose the RFID key fob or if it’s stolen, someone else could use it and have access to your important accounts,” Cossolotto said. “VeriPay solves that problem. It’s subdermal and very difficult to lose. You don’t leave it sitting in the backseat of the taxi.”

RFID tags are miniscule microchips, which some manufacturers have managed to shrink to half the size of a grain of sand. They listen for a radio query and respond by transmitting a unique ID code, typically a 64-bit identifier yielding about 18 thousand trillion possible values. Most RFID tags have no batteries. They use the power from the initial radio signal to transmit their response.

When embedded in human bodies, RFID tags raise unique security concerns. First, because they broadcast their ID number, a thief could rig up his or her own device to intercept and then rebroadcast the signal to an ATM. Second, sufficiently dedicated thieves may try to slice the tags out of their victims.

“We do hear concerns about this from a privacy point of view,” Cossolotto said. “Obviously the company wants to do all it can to protect privacy. If you don’t want it anymore ... you can go to a doctor and have it removed. It’s not something I would recommend people do at home. I call it an opt-out feature.”

Chris Hoofnagle, a lawyer at the Electronic Privacy Information Center said implanted RFID tags cause an additional worry. “When your bank card is compromised, all you have to do is make a call to the issuer,” Hoofnagle said. “In this case, you have to make a call to a surgeon.

“It doesn’t make sense to go from a card, which is controlled by an individual, to a chip, which you cannot control.”

ADS shares have slid from a high of around $12 in 2000 to 40 cents, and the company is now fighting to stay listed on the Nasdaq. “Our common stock did not regain the minimum bid price requirement and on Oct. 28, 2003, the Nasdaq Stock Market informed us by letter that our securities would be delisted from the SmallCap,” ADS said in a Nov. 14 filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission. The company also warned that its implantable microchips are manufactured solely by Raytheon without a “formal written agreement,” and any price increases or supply disruptions would have serious negative consequences.

MasterCard has been testing an RFID technology called PayPass. It looks like any other credit card but is outfitted with an RFID tag that lets it be read by a receiver instead of scanned through a magnetic stripe. “We’re certainly looking at designs like key fobs,” Mastercard Vice President Art Kranzley told USA Today last week. “It could be in a pen or a pair of earrings. Ultimately, it could be embedded in anything—someday, maybe even under the skin.”

ADS is running a special promotion urging Americans to “get chipped.” The first 100,000 people to sign up will receive a $50 discount.

Po 11-27-2003 12:07 AM


I found this article from a reputable news source.
Oh, SC, we know you're incapable of finding info from a reputable news source. You kidder!.. :D

But, seriously, I wouldn't do it. Too 1984/Big Brother/"The Man" for me. I wouldn't even get one of those automatic gas cards on my car bumper (or wherever it goes) on my car (if I had a car).

ScaryCurl 11-27-2003 12:53 AM


Originally Posted by Pochacco

I found this article from a reputable news source.
Oh, SC, we know you're incapable of finding info from a reputable news source. You kidder!.. :D

LOL. Geez, I guess that did sound pretty oxy-moronic. I guess what I meant was MSNBC is a little more respected than most, i.e. Fox or CNN.

Summer91 11-27-2003 01:50 AM

No way! Never! And for reasons most ppl here (I think) would not understand. I reiterate... no way!

charli 11-27-2003 03:18 AM

Well at least I wouldn't lose it anymore :)

But hey, then thieves could just scan your body as you're walking by and steal your info.

Magpie 11-27-2003 04:30 AM

It seems like this kind of technology would be bringing us one step closer to a Minority Report-type world where our every move is monitored. That freaks me out. I have to vote no.

curlylaura 11-27-2003 05:08 AM


sufficiently dedicated thieves may try to slice the tags out of their victims.
No way, for the above reason.

karyzma 11-27-2003 10:21 AM

Not a chance for the same reasons as Summer91.

ScaryCurl 11-27-2003 07:50 PM


Originally Posted by Summer91
No way! Never! And for reasons most ppl here (I think) would not understand. I reiterate... no way!


msrandee 11-27-2003 08:01 PM

No, but the way technology is advancing, I'll bet you it will become common and/or required at some point in the future. Hey, at least you wouldn't have to worry about getting your ATM card stuck in the machine.

pooky 11-28-2003 12:58 AM

people would still find a way to get your card....they would just slice you open to get it. :shock:

Brynnderella 11-28-2003 05:28 PM

Some rapture buffs are saying the verichip's the mark of the beast since it's to be put on your hand or forehead, and one might need it eventually to buy or sell anything.

fig jam 11-28-2003 05:48 PM

I voted no. There was a really good article in National Geographic a month or so ago about privacy and all the ways we are "observed" by new technologies, all the time.

Loose association note: when I first read the title of the thread, I pictured an entire ATM card under your skin, little rectangle poking out . . . :shock: Sorry, I think in cartoons.

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